Fixing DJI's Compass Problem

[paxpincer]

Right so by flying performance you mean your still getting the 'hook'?
I havent even got as far as looking into that as my TBE is so out of control.

cheers

 

[Pazz]

Here is the video of the suggestion that was made regarding doing the calibration in a certain order in order to avoid TBE.

It doesn't work well in my current location (Quebec City, Canada)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yrG-TbM ... e=youtu.be

Had a look at video. Given that you are launching in an area full of trees & houses, I"m not surprised at low level TBE. At the lower level, GPS reception is confused as it is bouncing off buildings/trees/cars & concrete. Once you well cleared tree height/buildings all settled down?
Try in a more open area it see if lower level TBE happens. If I need to operating in that sort of confined location I take it up straight away to clear low level objects or take off from a nearby clear area & fly to location at operating height.
PS forgot to mention that in your video I noticed you did your compass calc. right next to a car. This is a big no no. see video http://youtu.be/01rZ3oIHgyQ

 

[robby666111]

Right so by flying performance you mean your still getting the 'hook'?
I havent even got as far as looking into that as my TBE is so out of control.

cheers

Just ignore Pazz. He is talking rubbish and is a well known forum Troll.
Yes, flying performance is the J-hook, and not flying straight. Certainly the TBE is improved. As to the question re warranty, I would doubt that this would void the warranty, but if I was returned a unit for a warranty claim I would revert the compass to its original position.
Cheers
Rob.

 

[Pazz]

Right so by flying performance you mean your still getting the 'hook'?
I havent even got as far as looking into that as my TBE is so out of control.

cheers

Just ignore Pazz. He is talking rubbish and is a well known forum Troll.
Yes, flying performance is the J-hook, and not flying straight. Certainly the TBE is improved. As to the question re warranty, I would doubt that this would void the warranty, but if I was returned a unit for a warranty claim I would revert the compass to its original position.
Cheers
Rob.

Maybe the troll has his eyes & mind open to see what the problem is. Seeing peoples videos are a real eye opener as opposed to what they say. All the things DJI say not to do is happening here. So I'm happy to troll along & be helpful.xxxx
ps I was talking to pgaucher not paxpincer!!

 

[BigBadFun]

Pazz. Please. I'm begging you. Please go back to your cell and ask the nurse to restrict you access to the outside world until they've refined you medication. I'm really concerned for your mental health.

Loved your new video though...

http://youtu.be/Hr6rp0HYgQ8

 

[damoncooper]

Pazz. Please. I'm begging you. Please go back to your cell and ask the nurse to restrict you access to the outside world until they've refined you medication. I'm really concerned for your mental health.

Loved your new video though...

http://youtu.be/Hr6rp0HYgQ8

Zombies!!

Lol.

Alright, seriously though: any word on getting 3.0.5b2 out to more testers or any further communication from DJI?

 

[Pazz]

Pazz. Please. I'm begging you. Please go back to your cell and ask the nurse to restrict you access to the outside world until they've refined you medication. I'm really concerned for your mental health.

Loved your new video though...

http://youtu.be/Hr6rp0HYgQ8

Looks more like it was made for you mate. By the way, hanging around in the clouds over christchurch (profile description)says alot about your attitude to safety. Not to mention that your tight trousers are restricting the blood flow to your head.
You started it, can do this forever mate.

 

[robby666111]

seriously though: any word on getting 3.0.5b2 out to more testers or any further communication from DJI?

Hopefully by the end of the week. Looks like Ianwood got a release candidate and it has been mentioned to other (non-beta) testers that the public release by the end of this week.. Fingers crossed.

 

[Pazz]

My first Phantom Vision 2+ was a great flyer: stable, steady, reliable. That's the one that I ended up crashing due to pilot error. I then purchased an identical second one, and it has not been the same experience. This on feels twitchy, sometimes (not always) displays the TBE effect, and it feels much less reliable.

The main difference is that the first one was running firmware version 1.x, this one runs 3.04. That said, I doubt the firmware would be the culprit of such dramatic flight discrepancies. Furthermore, I understand that some, but not all, Vision 2+ are affected by TBE and the magnetic declination issue.

So, if not all same model aircrafts are so affected, it stands to reason that the software is not to blame (assuming they are all running the same firmware). Yet, a firmware solution is being sought from DJI, but in fact does anybody know the root cause of this issue? Could it be a batch of "bad" compasses that have been installed in some units? Is it some other hardware issue? Does anybody have a deeper engineering understanding of this issue? Thank you for your insights.

You will not have much hope of getting "deeper engineering understanding"on this thread. Asked this question myself a few times, with zero response. I think you are dead right, the issues are broader & I like your more open mind to seek answers based on science rather than guess work.

 

[wkf94025]

Pazz. Please. I'm begging you. Please go back to your cell and ask the nurse to restrict you access to the outside world until they've refined you medication. I'm really concerned for your mental health.

Loved your new video though...

http://youtu.be/Hr6rp0HYgQ8

Hilarious video. Not sure if that is Pazz or DJI's VP of Engineering...

Kelly

 

[gr8pics]

As a rookie with a brand new P2, will this cause any serious trouble for me risking a crash?

Ive heard that compass errors are the most common cause for crashes, if they arent switched to manual mode, is that correct?
How do i enable manual mode if i have a Mac?

Thanks

 

[AnselA]

...compass calc...

What is compass calc.???

 

[John Shaw]

My first Phantom Vision 2+ was a great flyer: stable, steady, reliable. That's the one that I ended up crashing due to pilot error. I then purchased an identical second one, and it has not been the same experience. This on feels twitchy, sometimes (not always) displays the TBE effect, and it feels much less reliable.

The main difference is that the first one was running firmware version 1.x, this one runs 3.04. That said, I doubt the firmware would be the culprit of such dramatic flight discrepancies. Furthermore, I understand that some, but not all, Vision 2+ are affected by TBE and the magnetic declination issue.

So, if not all same model aircrafts are so affected, it stands to reason that the software is not to blame (assuming they are all running the same firmware). Yet, a firmware solution is being sought from DJI, but in fact does anybody know the root cause of this issue? Could it be a batch of "bad" compasses that have been installed in some units? Is it some other hardware issue? Does anybody have a deeper engineering understanding of this issue? Thank you for your insights.

You will not have much hope of getting "deeper engineering understanding"on this thread. Asked this question myself a few times, with zero response. I think you are dead right, the issues are broader & I like your more open mind to seek answers based on science rather than guess work.

You are right that DJI does not provide the opportunity for any in-depth greater understanding...
But this isn't guess work...
Remember that early in this issue Ianwood assembled a list of those effected. Those that are effected are in eastern or western North America (not in the center), east coast of Australia, New Zealand, and the southern tip of Africa. All places with a declination of 10 degrees or greater. Almost no one else reports being affected. As this list grows the places where people are effected stays the same.

So through this and other threads it was determined that there was a very strong correlation to declination. Navigation systems have to deal with this, and most do. It is a real issue and well known phenomenon that has to do with the earth's magnetic field.

You shouldn't doubt that firmware could be the problem. The firmware can do anything since it's in control. Since I have flown 1.x and 3.04 and they fly generally the same. (I am at a declination of 17 degrees and strongly effected) It is more likely you may find your firmware gains were different and that could make a Huge difference. High gains are generally more twitchy than low gains, etc. These can be changed with the assistant.

Some people notice these problems more than others probably based on their piloting technique and the tasks they are trying to do. If you take off in an empty field and just fly the Phantom you may not notice much of a problem. Initially I flew mine on a pair of soccer fields, noticed it didn't always fly straight, but didn't think much about it (RC aircraft are far worse as they have NO navigation or stabilization system). When I read Ianwood's initial post on this issue a light bulb went on and it all made sense. I ran my own test flights and confirmed it made sense. And DJI agrees this is a firmware problem otherwise they would be revising the firmware. On the other hand if you are trying to fly in a tight area or hold to a specific line you will surely notice it quickly - if you are in an area of high declination.

By the way, after I became familiar with how it flew, I have been able to fly 1.x through 3.04 etc firmware in my confined tree lined backyard - you just have to stay on top of it to keep dampening the TBE and not making long high speed runs that lead to JHook. After a few minutes the effect goes away (another indication it is a firmware issue) and you can fly relaxed.

I hope that gives some perspective

 

[gr8pics]

How do u know youre in a aera of high declination?

 

[Navman]

Enter your location here http://magnetic-declination.com/

 

[myeyecu]

Add me to the growing list. Mine doesn't suffer much TBE but it does hook left. In southern Arizona I don't have trees to hit but lots of sagauaro's.

 

[ToddSmi]

You are right that DJI does not provide the opportunity for any in-depth greater understanding...
But this isn't guess work...
Remember that early in this issue Ianwood assembled a list of those effected. Those that are effected are in eastern or western North America (not in the center), east coast of Australia, New Zealand, and the southern tip of Africa. All places with a declination of 10 degrees or greater. Almost no one else reports being affected. As this list grows the places where people are effected stays the same.

So through this and other threads it was determined that there was a very strong correlation to declination. Navigation systems have to deal with this, and most do. It is a real issue and well known phenomenon that has to do with the earth's magnetic field.

You shouldn't doubt that firmware could be the problem. The firmware can do anything since it's in control. Since I have flown 1.x and 3.04 and they fly generally the same. (I am at a declination of 17 degrees and strongly effected) It is more likely you may find your firmware gains were different and that could make a Huge difference. High gains are generally more twitchy than low gains, etc. These can be changed with the assistant.

Some people notice these problems more than others probably based on their piloting technique and the tasks they are trying to do. If you take off in an empty field and just fly the Phantom you may not notice much of a problem. Initially I flew mine on a pair of soccer fields, noticed it didn't always fly straight, but didn't think much about it (RC aircraft are far worse as they have NO navigation or stabilization system). When I read Ianwood's initial post on this issue a light bulb went on and it all made sense. I ran my own test flights and confirmed it made sense. And DJI agrees this is a firmware problem otherwise they would be revising the firmware. On the other hand if you are trying to fly in a tight area or hold to a specific line you will surely notice it quickly - if you are in an area of high declination.

By the way, after I became familiar with how it flew, I have been able to fly 1.x through 3.04 etc firmware in my confined tree lined backyard - you just have to stay on top of it to keep dampening the TBE and not making long high speed runs that lead to JHook. After a few minutes the effect goes away (another indication it is a firmware issue) and you can fly relaxed.

I hope that gives some perspective

I always enjoy your posts John and appreciate that you try to take the emotion out of the equation as much as possible. After lots of research on this topic, I tend to share your thought that firmware is an important part of the equation when it comes to the magnetic declination issue. However, I still have not seen anyone come up with a rationale explanation for why all P2 craft in severe MD areas do not appear to be affected. I personally, have had a combination of 4 Vision and Vision+ units, and only experienced the problem on 1 unit (testing in similar location which is +13 degrees). I also have a relative with a Vision in the same area and his unit does exhibit the problem. So combined, we are 2 out of 5 with the problem. Why are the other 3 not displaying the j-hook or TBE whatsoever? The only explanation I've heard people give is that you probably just didn't notice it before. For me, that is just not the case. I am very in tune with my copters and how they behave and respond to my controls.

So I'm still baffled as to why some units do fine and some do not, in the same area, with all other things apparently being equal. I realize that in a forum like this when the objective is to move a company to action, it's not popular to talk about why some units appear not to be affected, but I think it's worthy of consideration and debate, and IMHO doesn't take away from what Drunken Sparrow (for whom I'm very appreciative) is trying to accomplish. Rather, by recognizing that for whatever reason some units do seem to operate without the effects of MD, ultimately we may learn even more about the root cause of the problem or quite possibly causes (plural) of the problem.

 

[Pazz]

You are right that DJI does not provide the opportunity for any in-depth greater understanding...
But this isn't guess work...
Remember that early in this issue Ianwood assembled a list of those effected. Those that are effected are in eastern or western North America (not in the center), east coast of Australia, New Zealand, and the southern tip of Africa. All places with a declination of 10 degrees or greater. Almost no one else reports being affected. As this list grows the places where people are effected stays the same.

So through this and other threads it was determined that there was a very strong correlation to declination. Navigation systems have to deal with this, and most do. It is a real issue and well known phenomenon that has to do with the earth's magnetic field.

You shouldn't doubt that firmware could be the problem. The firmware can do anything since it's in control. Since I have flown 1.x and 3.04 and they fly generally the same. (I am at a declination of 17 degrees and strongly effected) It is more likely you may find your firmware gains were different and that could make a Huge difference. High gains are generally more twitchy than low gains, etc. These can be changed with the assistant.

Some people notice these problems more than others probably based on their piloting technique and the tasks they are trying to do. If you take off in an empty field and just fly the Phantom you may not notice much of a problem. Initially I flew mine on a pair of soccer fields, noticed it didn't always fly straight, but didn't think much about it (RC aircraft are far worse as they have NO navigation or stabilization system). When I read Ianwood's initial post on this issue a light bulb went on and it all made sense. I ran my own test flights and confirmed it made sense. And DJI agrees this is a firmware problem otherwise they would be revising the firmware. On the other hand if you are trying to fly in a tight area or hold to a specific line you will surely notice it quickly - if you are in an area of high declination.

By the way, after I became familiar with how it flew, I have been able to fly 1.x through 3.04 etc firmware in my confined tree lined backyard - you just have to stay on top of it to keep dampening the TBE and not making long high speed runs that lead to JHook. After a few minutes the effect goes away (another indication it is a firmware issue) and you can fly relaxed.

I hope that gives some perspective

I always enjoy your posts John and appreciate that you try to take the emotion out of the equation as much as possible. After lots of research on this topic, I tend to share your thought that firmware is an important part of the equation when it comes to the magnetic declination issue. However, I still have not seen anyone come up with a rationale explanation for why all P2 craft in severe MD areas do not appear to be affected. I personally, have had a combination of 4 Vision and Vision+ units, and only experienced the problem on 1 unit (testing in similar location which is +13 degrees). I also have a relative with a Vision in the same area and his unit does exhibit the problem. So combined, we are 2 out of 5 with the problem. Why are the other 3 not displaying the j-hook or TBE whatsoever? The only explanation I've heard people give is that you probably just didn't notice it before. For me, that is just not the case. I am very in tune with my copters and how they behave and respond to my controls.

So I'm still baffled as to why some units do fine and some do not, in the same area, with all other things apparently being equal. I realize that in a forum like this when the objective is to move a company to action, it's not popular to talk about why some units appear not to be affected, but I think it's worthy of consideration and debate, and IMHO doesn't take away from what Drunken Sparrow (for whom I'm very appreciative) is trying to accomplish. Rather, by recognizing that for whatever reason some units do seem to operate without the effects of MD, ultimately we may learn even more about the root cause of the problem or quite possibly causes (plural) of the problem.

Well said. The interesting thing this highlights is that we only hear from the people who report a problem, not from all those who don't. If your small survey of 2 out of 5 is representative, then alot of people out there are happy. So it raises the question what have DJI done in this 3.05 to actually address the issue raised by people here? Is it going to affect users who don"t have a problem? Ian should beta test to those who don't have an issue (such as yourself) to be sure. Of course with a option it can be uninstalled if things go wrong.

 

[ianwood]

It's a little late to have this debate. This effects 100% of P2s. And it is a firmware issue. There is a plethora of data to back this up. And we've had a number of reports of P2s that were apparently immune and it has turned out each time that they weren't being flown in a way to notice it.

You guys are welcome to continue debating it but you're just rehashing what's been covered in this thread numerous times already. All the information is already here. However, I don't want wild speculation being presented as fact.

 

[Pazz]

It's a little late to have this debate. This effects 100% of P2s. And it is a firmware issue. There is a plethora of data to back this up. And we've had a number of reports of P2s that were apparently immune and it has turned out each time that they weren't being flown in a way to notice it.

You guys are welcome to continue debating it but you're just rehashing what's been covered in this thread numerous times already. All the information is already here. However, I don't want wild speculation being presented as fact.

So you are totally ignoring toddsmi? You can't back up that it affects 100% of P2 as you have only heard from those with a problem. Have you offered beta testing to any European people with zero declination? Have dji told you how 3.05 works? I.e. Does it have declination table to detect location of individual operators & correct for them? etc etc