Did some flying, dodged a couple of low fliers

[Cellblock776]

It's a nice day although we have a line of thundershowers to the west about to roll in this afternoon. So I figured on spending a bit of my morning off work doing a bit of UAV flying over my neighborhood. Just playing around doing some lazy, relaxing flying with my Phantom 3 Standard. Not far out, just keeping it in VLOS and about 200' AGL. I got through one battery, about 15 minutes, landed and swapped out to a 2nd battery and went back up to about 250'AGL and was over a vacant lot across the street when I heard an airplane engine. I dropped immediately as I saw a single engine fixed wing with PIPELINE INSPECTION printed under the wings heading right at my sUAS. I decided that I wasn't loosing altitude quickly enough and pitched left to get close to a pecan tree that I was near. I have pine trees that are about 120' near me and I know the pecan tree is ~80' tall. As I jinxed right the plane went to my right and flew over at me at approx 200AGL. Way too close for comfort. I was experiencing a pucker factor of 7.
I hovered about 75' AGL for a minute and as I was about to head back up, I heard rotor blades of a helo. I couldn't see it until the chopper, a 4 door Bell type, passed between a couple of trees and buildings less than 100 yards away. This aircraft appeared to be flying along some powerlines next to some railroad tracks which pass near my house. He was well under 300'AGL as he flew past me. I stayed down below the treetops, about 70 feet, until he was gone and I no longer heard him.
So it was time to get back up to altitude and shortly after going back up to about 300'AGL I heard the sound of rotors again. The helo was coming back. I dropped back down to below 100' and got near my friendly trees which I figure the manned aircraft will try to stay away from. I watched as the helo passed a little further away this time, going back the way he had come from a couple of minutes before.
Did I mention that, in addition to staying within VLOS and staying under 400' I always run an app like FlightRadar24 on my phone to keep tabs on local air traffic in my area of operation? And did I mention that neither the fixed wing Pipeline Inspection plane nor the powerline helo ever showed up on the App like all of the other jets zipping around the sky today? I never had any warning that they were heading toward me until they were both within a mile of my Phantom.
I didn't get the close encounter with the Pipeline inspection plane on video because I wasn't planning on doing any filming, especially of an oncoming aircraft. I REALLY Wish I had that to show how low he was and how close he got at I dropped and turned away from him.
When the helicopter returned I was videoing and have it recorded and made a short video to share with others. I dropped below the trees as he passed me this second time and this perspective shows how important it is to always keep your UAV in sight and to keep scanning the sky for other aircraft.

That said, until we have some sort of universal transponder system in place and EVERYBODY is using it, I don't see how we can have things like autonomous package deliveries or inspection flights sharing the same airspace as these low flying manned aircraft.

 

[Pixies Channel.]

Nice video mate, Yeah that helicopter did fly a little low, I thought these rules were for all aircraft or are they not the same for Helicopters.

 

[Cellblock776]

Nice video mate, Yeah that helicopter did fly a little low, I thought these rules were for all aircraft or are they not the same for Helicopters.

Some people will tell you that general aviation is supposed to stay over 500'agl but that is not the case. As you can see, I live along power lines and railroad tracks, a highway and there are numerous pipelines in the area. I routinely see manned aircraft flying well under 500' and often not much higher than the trees or cell phone towers in the area. It can be scary sometimes when you want to just relax, go up a couple hundred feet and get a bit of stick time.

 

[Deleted member 109724]

Dude, I had an experience like that last week, I was flying my Phantom over my house, when a large privately owned airplane came into view. I was cruising at 350 feet agl, when he changed course and started flying right toward my Phantom! It only descends at 6 or 7 mph, and the airplane flew literally within a few feet of it on purpose as I was trying to descend. My heart fell into my legs as I watched from directly under it, as it passed within 30 feet or so. I landed my bird thank heavens, but now I'll be even more careful to listen for other propellers in my area! BTW in my area laws aren't enforced very well, and we have a few "roof skinners" who literally fly their airplanes down to about 300 feet agl, do a dive to about 80 feet agl, and pull up, swooping over the houses. Very stupid. We had one guy shut off the engine and do a free fall , and then he started his engine and resumed scaring the living daylights out of the residents of my fair community. Long story short, beware and be good!!!

 

[Cellblock776]

Weston Ney, Thanks for the comment and Yes, I have had the same experience. While flying I see a manned aircraft and I begin to detour and move away only to find that the plane or chopper has turned toward my UAV and appears to fly toward, no, strike that, not toward it, At it. The Pipeline inspection plane today actually looked like it turned toward and down at my UAV as I was dropping down and pealing away to get clear of him. If I had the encounter on video I would file a complaint with the local FAA office. Sadly I didn't record it.

 

[N017RW]

Dude, I had an experience like that last week, I was flying my Phantom over my house, when a large privately owned airplane came into view. I was cruising at 350 feet agl, when he changed course and started flying right toward my Phantom! It only descends at 6 or 7 mph, and the airplane flew literally within a few feet of it on purpose as I was trying to descend. My heart fell into my legs as I watched from directly under it, as it passed within 30 feet or so. I landed my bird thank heavens, but now I'll be even more careful to listen for other propellers in my area! BTW in my area laws aren't enforced very well, and we have a few "roof skinners" who literally fly their airplanes down to about 300 feet agl, do a dive to about 80 feet agl, and pull up, swooping over the houses. Very stupid. We had one guy shut off the engine and do a free fall , and then he started his engine and resumed scaring the living daylights out of the residents of my fair community. Long story short, beware and be good!!!

It’s doubtful the engine was shut off. No one trains that way. It was most likely just pulled back to idle which is very quiet.
Regardless, you will always have to yield to manned aircraft.

 

[Deleted member 109724]

Weston Ney, Thanks for the comment and Yes, I have had the same experience. While flying I see a manned aircraft and I begin to detour and move away only to find that the plane or chopper has turned toward my UAV and appears to fly toward, no, strike that, not toward it, At it. The Pipeline inspection plane today actually looked like it turned toward and down at my as I was dropping down and pealing away to get clear of him. If I had the encounter on video I would file a complaint with the local FAA office. Sadly I didn't record it.

I record every minute of all my flights, at the expense of hard drive space, but I want to catch everything on film just in case something happens. I don't know why a man's pilot aircraft would want to fly towards a drone, when a drone can be dangerous to their propellers. If I were flying a manned aircraft, I would be fearful of the Drone pilot making quick movements, because Phantoms can go 35 miles per hour, and they are unpredictable! Who knows what the drone pilot might do! And they could cause crashes, it could be that the manned aircraft pilot is trying to freak out drone Pilots thinking they are invincible and so that they can do near misses, kind of like when you are on your dirt bike, and do near misses on your little sister, and laugh when she screams LOL.

 

[BigAl07]

Keep in mind that just like us, manned aircraft can request and get "Waivers" from the FAA regs. A power line inspection/clearing is just one example.

Also keep in mind that HELO are not held to the 500'/1000' min like fixed wing are. A helo could be potentially any place at any time.

As stated already, it's OUR responsibility to avoid them even if they seem to be doing something unsafe or illegal.

@Weston Ney Photography I'd bet money that pilot didn't kill the motor but maybe just pulled it to idle. Also you'd be surprised how hard it is to see a small sUAS from the air when your operating a small plane. Heck it's hard to see other full sized aircraft at times let alone a small speck on the horizon.

 

[Monte55]

Probably flight training. See it all the time.

 

[BigAl07]

I always run an app like FlightRadar24 on my phone to keep tabs on local air traffic in my area of operation? And did I mention that neither the fixed wing Pipeline Inspection plane nor the powerline helo ever showed up on the App like all of the other jets zipping around the sky today?

@Cellblock776 you need to understand where FlightRadar24 gets it's information and there is a HUGE gap in it. HUGE!!!

FlightRadar24 ONLY shows you aircraft that are being actively tracked by ATC. If you're not in an area fairly close to ATC there very well might (probably are) aircraft flying freely and not under ATC Flight Following. Read the information below and pay attention to the items in red (my formatting) as this could make a HUGE difference:

Flightradar24 aggregates data from three sources:[3]

1. Automatic dependent surveillance-broadcast (ADS-B). The principal source is a large number of ground based ADS-B receivers, which collect data from any aircraft in their local area that are equipped with an ADS-B transponder and feed this data to the internet in real time. The aircraft-based transponders use the GPS and other flight data input to transmit signals containing aircraft registration, position, altitude, velocity and other flight data. Currently, about 65% of aircraft in Europe are equipped with ADS-B but only 35% in the US. For example: all Airbus aircraft are ADS-B equipped but Boeing 707, 717, 727, 737-200, 747-100, 747-200, 747SP do not come equipped and are not generally visible unless retrofitted by their operators. Typical ADS-B receivers include Kinetic Avonics′s SBS-1 and AirNav-systems's AirNav and these receivers are run by volunteers, mostly aviation enthusiasts. ADS-B signals can also be received and uploaded by a low-cost Software-defined radio, such as those based on the $15 R820T tuner.[4]
2. Multilateration (MLAT). The second major source is multilateration using Flightradar24 (FR24) receivers. All aircraft types will be visible in areas covered by MLAT, even without ADS-B, but while 99% of Europe is covered, only parts of the US are. At least four receivers are needed to calculate the position of an aircraft.[3]
3. Federal Aviation Administration. The shortfall in the US is mostly made up from 5 minute delayed data from the Federal Aviation Administration (FAA) but this may not include aircraft registration and other information.

So keep the above information in mind if you're using this (or any flight following Ap) because you're only seeing a slice of the pie not the whole thing. I'm a manned aviation pilot and fly a LOT of the time W/O flight following and well below RADAR levels in my area of the country.

 

[Deleted member 109724]

Yes, it is VERY important that the drone Pilot keeps his eye on the sky. We are responsible for avoiding the manned aircraft, they aren't responsible for avoiding us. Makes sense in my mind. That's why I never operate my drone from my car or my lazyboy in the house, you have to WATCH and LISTEN.

 

[Deleted member 109724]

Have fun Cellblock776, and watch them tornadoes!

 

[Nightwolf]

Sadly I didn't record it.

After missing a chance to record my first epic crash I record from wheels up to wheels down. 1's and 0's are cheap

 

[mdowney58]

@Cellblock776 you need to understand where FlightRadar24 gets it's information and there is a HUGE gap in it. HUGE!!!

FlightRadar24 ONLY shows you aircraft that are being actively tracked by ATC. If you're not in an area fairly close to ATC there very well might (probably are) aircraft flying freely and not under ATC Flight Following. Read the information below and pay attention to the items in red (my formatting) as this could make a HUGE difference:

Flightradar24 aggregates data from three sources:[3]

1. Automatic dependent surveillance-broadcast (ADS-B). The principal source is a large number of ground based ADS-B receivers, which collect data from any aircraft in their local area that are equipped with an ADS-B transponder and feed this data to the internet in real time. The aircraft-based transponders use the GPS and other flight data input to transmit signals containing aircraft registration, position, altitude, velocity and other flight data. Currently, about 65% of aircraft in Europe are equipped with ADS-B but only 35% in the US. For example: all Airbus aircraft are ADS-B equipped but Boeing 707, 717, 727, 737-200, 747-100, 747-200, 747SP do not come equipped and are not generally visible unless retrofitted by their operators. Typical ADS-B receivers include Kinetic Avonics′s SBS-1 and AirNav-systems's AirNav and these receivers are run by volunteers, mostly aviation enthusiasts. ADS-B signals can also be received and uploaded by a low-cost Software-defined radio, such as those based on the $15 R820T tuner.[4]
2. Multilateration (MLAT). The second major source is multilateration using Flightradar24 (FR24) receivers. All aircraft types will be visible in areas covered by MLAT, even without ADS-B, but while 99% of Europe is covered, only parts of the US are. At least four receivers are needed to calculate the position of an aircraft.[3]
3. Federal Aviation Administration. The shortfall in the US is mostly made up from 5 minute delayed data from the Federal Aviation Administration (FAA) but this may not include aircraft registration and other information.

So keep the above information in mind if you're using this (or any flight following Ap) because you're only seeing a slice of the pie not the whole thing. I'm a manned aviation pilot and fly a LOT of the time W/O flight following and well below RADAR levels in my area of the country.

I was going to ask a different question regarding the above.
The OP is using a Standard, so there's a chance that while flying, his data is turned off on his device (unless he's using a second device), so FlightRadar24 may not even be updating.

 

[Cellblock776]

I was going to ask a different question regarding the above.
The OP is using a Standard, so there's a chance that while flying, his data is turned off on his device (unless he's using a second device), so FlightRadar24 may not even be updating.

I use a Galaxy Tab E 9.6 inch tablet on my controller for running the DJI Go App when I fly. Additionally I will either run Flight Radar 24 on my phone which I keep within sight nearby or I plug an SDR dongle into a 7 inch android tablet and run the Avate ADSB Pro software app on it.

 

[N017RW]

People rely far too much on Apps.

Some are no more than 3rd-party data miners with proximity errors and inherent latency.

 

[Cellblock776]

People rely far too much on Apps.

Some are no more than 3rd-party data miners with proximity errors and inherent latency.

All I know is that if an aircraft is within 20 miles of me and is transmitting out over ADS-B I can see them on my tablet with my SDR dongle and mag mount antenna. Those aircraft not transmitting ADS-B don't show up. Everyone is supposed to be using them by 2020 but with less than 18 months until the deadline I don't see things getting much better.

 

[Timinator]

It's a nice day although we have a line of thundershowers to the west about to roll in this afternoon. So I figured on spending a bit of my morning off work doing a bit of UAV flying over my neighborhood. Just playing around doing some lazy, relaxing flying with my Phantom 3 Standard. Not far out, just keeping it in VLOS and about 200' AGL. I got through one battery, about 15 minutes, landed and swapped out to a 2nd battery and went back up to about 250'AGL and was over a vacant lot across the street when I heard an airplane engine. I dropped immediately as I saw a single engine fixed wing with PIPELINE INSPECTION printed under the wings heading right at my sUAS. I decided that I wasn't loosing altitude quickly enough and pitched left to get close to a pecan tree that I was near. I have pine trees that are about 120' near me and I know the pecan tree is ~80' tall. As I jinxed right the plane went to my right and flew over at me at approx 200AGL. Way too close for comfort. I was experiencing a pucker factor of 7.
I hovered about 75' AGL for a minute and as I was about to head back up, I heard rotor blades of a helo. I couldn't see it until the chopper, a 4 door Bell type, passed between a couple of trees and buildings less than 100 yards away. This aircraft appeared to be flying along some powerlines next to some railroad tracks which pass near my house. He was well under 300'AGL as he flew past me. I stayed down below the treetops, about 70 feet, until he was gone and I no longer heard him.
So it was time to get back up to altitude and shortly after going back up to about 300'AGL I heard the sound of rotors again. The helo was coming back. I dropped back down to below 100' and got near my friendly trees which I figure the manned aircraft will try to stay away from. I watched as the helo passed a little further away this time, going back the way he had come from a couple of minutes before.
Did I mention that, in addition to staying within VLOS and staying under 400' I always run an app like FlightRadar24 on my phone to keep tabs on local air traffic in my area of operation? And did I mention that neither the fixed wing Pipeline Inspection plane nor the powerline helo ever showed up on the App like all of the other jets zipping around the sky today? I never had any warning that they were heading toward me until they were both within a mile of my Phantom.
I didn't get the close encounter with the Pipeline inspection plane on video because I wasn't planning on doing any filming, especially of an oncoming aircraft. I REALLY Wish I had that to show how low he was and how close he got at I dropped and turned away from him.
When the helicopter returned I was videoing and have it recorded and made a short video to share with others. I dropped below the trees as he passed me this second time and this perspective shows how important it is to always keep your UAV in sight and to keep scanning the sky for other aircraft.

That said, until we have some sort of universal transponder system in place and EVERYBODY is using it, I don't see how we can have things like autonomous package deliveries or inspection flights sharing the same airspace as these low flying manned aircraft.

Surprisingly enough, I had the same thing happen today with a very low flying Cherokee. Was coming right at me and even though I was at 90metre (altitude limit in Canada for UAS) I couldn't really tell his altitude. Descending is too slow on the P4P so my new avoidance strategy is rotate 90 degrees and then full throttle to clear out of the way. Odds are he will keep flying straight so a quick rotation and full throttle gets me out of his flight path. Unnerving but seems to be happening a lot lately.

 

[Neon Euc]

Very scary when that happens. Nothing more scary then hearing a helicopter but can't see it in the sky or from the drone camera. Is it me or does anyone else have issues telling which direction a helicopter is coming from when you first hear it?

Anyway you done the right thing cellblock776, reminds me when I sent my drone last year on a litchi mission, lost contact with it then heard the helicopter.....went through about 5 pants in 5 mins crapping myself. Lol
But lesson learned on that one.

 

[flockshot]

Every time one of those low flying aircraft report a UAV in the proximity of their flight path, it is another nail in the UAV coffin