Police stopped me

[JetFalcon]

Yesterday is the first time I've been interrogated (sorta) by police for flying my drone. Flew at Huntington Beach Pier, where they had the US Open of Surf. I set up my drone and fly for about 5 seconds until police walked over and told me to land my drone.

I land it and they start telling me how the sponsors of event have Proprietary ownership of the area for the surf competition. Saying only drones who work for event can be there. Otherwise I believe it's fine any other day.

They make me wait like 10-15 min for their undercover detective to explain stuff to me. Stuff about FAA and how I need to call the heliport. And keep saying how the FAA could get involved and fine me, and educated me how crazy the FAA are on drones.

I fly at the beach all the time. But I assume we just have to share the airspace with helicopters and other planes. Most aircraft tend to fly over the water, further than I would wanna fly my drone. But do I have to call the heliports and be all serious on where my drone will be flying?

 

[N017RW]

Yesterday is the first time I've been interrogated (sorta) by police for flying my drone. Flew at Huntington Beach Pier, where they had the US Open of Surf. I set up my drone and fly for about 5 seconds until police walked over and told me to land my drone.

I land it and they start telling me how the sponsors of event have Proprietary ownership of the area for the surf competition. Saying only drones who work for event can be there. Otherwise I believe it's fine any other day.

They make me wait like 10-15 min for their undercover detective to explain stuff to me. Stuff about FAA and how I need to call the heliport. And keep saying how the FAA could get involved and fine me, and educated me how crazy the FAA are on drones.

I fly at the beach all the time. But I assume we just have to share the airspace with helicopters and other planes. Most aircraft tend to fly over the water, further than I would wanna fly my drone. But do I have to call the heliports and be all serious on where my drone will be flying?

Regarding last sentence/question, don't know the area and too lazy to look now... are you within 5 miles of it/one?
Thought everyone who's been around here as you have would know that by now.

 

[GMack]

They probably got you under this NOTAM: 7/4319 NOTAM Details

Basically, you cannot fly at any sporting event where capacity can reach 30,000 people, unless you can meet the NOTAM exemptions.

 

[LarBear360]

I work in HB but have never flown there. Other than the drilling platforms the only heliports I know of are at Civic Center and HBPD. Yes, I think both are within 5 miles of the pier. I don't buy the "proprietary ownership" argument though, considering the throngs of photographers lining the railings at the pier.

Bottom line is I think they just wanted you to go away and come back another day.

 

[Numone]

Yesterday is the first time I've been interrogated (sorta) by police for flying my drone. Flew at Huntington Beach Pier, where they had the US Open of Surf. I set up my drone and fly for about 5 seconds until police walked over and told me to land my drone.

I land it and they start telling me how the sponsors of event have Proprietary ownership of the area for the surf competition. Saying only drones who work for event can be there. Otherwise I believe it's fine any other day.

They make me wait like 10-15 min for their undercover detective to explain stuff to me. Stuff about FAA and how I need to call the heliport. And keep saying how the FAA could get involved and fine me, and educated me how crazy the FAA are on drones.

I fly at the beach all the time. But I assume we just have to share the airspace with helicopters and other planes. Most aircraft tend to fly over the water, further than I would wanna fly my drone. But do I have to call the heliports and be all serious on where my drone will be flying?

Sounds like utter nonsense from bored officers, who clearly have no idea of the regs.
Did you see other sUAVs in the vicinity?

 

[N017RW]

LB360, Aside from additional facts here yet understood, drones present public safety dangers terrestrial photographers don't.

 

[Fly Dawg]

If I looked at the map correctly, R I Seal Beach Helistop B80 , is the closest heliport. As the "crow" or "drone" in this case goes is approx. 8 miles out from the pier. You mentioned this " I land it and they start telling me how the sponsors of event have Proprietary ownership of the area for the surf competition. Saying only drones who work for event can be there."
If this is true, the only thing they would ask you to do is leave the area, if you were not authorized. In saying that, I am not sure that the event would be able to attain a "TFR" for such, and you should have been informed of that fact if that were the case. Sure, they could be "leasing" the area for the event purposes, but as far as the air space goes, that's another can of worms.

 

[MapMaker53]

According to AirMap, there are multiple heliports within 5 miles of the pier and the website provides the appropriate contact numbers for each to be used for notification purposes if you hover your mouse over them. So you were probably in violation for a number of reasons.

 

[macoman]

According to AirMap, there are multiple heliports within 5 miles of the pier and the website provides the appropriate contact numbers for each to be used for notification purposes if you hover your mouse over them. So you were probably in violation for a number of reasons.

View attachment 86450

That's why is very convenient to check online to see if the beach you are visiting allow drones. I am thinking to visit one of the NJ beaches but not sure which one allow drones because NJ started hating drones and many municipalities are prohibiting any type of drones in their area.

 

[Gulfstream]

There is never a problem at Huntington Beach on a normal day. You were stopped because of flying "over/near" a Major Sanctioned Sporting Event. The city "owns the beach/pier" they can dictate the rules as they see fit.

And yes... the permit seeker may request that drone activity operating from the beach within the permit area, be limited to their approved operators only for both safety, and copyright / usage concerns.

 

[SteveT777]

Was their helicopter flying in support of the event?

 

[Jiggly-Wiggly]

I'm curious as to how cops get "educated" about FAA regs and drone laws? I really can't see a bunch of cops sitting in a room getting a very thorough explanation of all current U.S. drone regulations from an FAA expert. Gut feeling tells me their "sarge" just tells them to go home and look up drones on Google and that will suffice for their "legal expertise" in dealing with drone pilots.

I was stopped by a Barney Fife type cop in a small Ohio town last year when I was flying my P3P in a public park. I didnt know RC models were prohibited in all public parks in that particular county, so it was my fault for not knowing the local ordinances. However, what made me angry was his accusation that I was "harassing people" with my drone simply because it was 75 feet above their heads and posed a "theoretical danger" if it fell out of the sky and hit someone. So then we got into a polite but heated discussion about what exactly constitutes "theoretical danger" of drones and I proceeded to tell him that baseball is legal in the public parks and people have been known to be seriously injured by flying bats and baseballs in the history of the United States. So why isn't baseball banned in parks like drones? Luckily I was able to keep my cool and be polite to this Barney Fife tough guy with a badge --- but it clearly illustrates the uphill battle we friendly and educated drone pilots have against the macho guys with guns and badges who think they are all Supreme Court justices with their knowledge of the law.

 

[Gulfstream]

I'm curious as to how cops get "educated" about FAA regs and drone laws? I really can't see a bunch of cops sitting in a room getting a very thorough explanation of all current U.S. drone regulations from an FAA expert. Gut feeling tells me their "sarge" just tells them to go home and look up drones on Google and that will suffice for their "legal expertise" in dealing with drone pilots.

I was stopped by a Barney Fife type cop in a small Ohio town last year when I was flying my P3P in a public park. I didnt know RC models were prohibited in all public parks in that particular county, so it was my fault for not knowing the local ordinances. However, what made me angry was his accusation that I was "harassing people" with my drone simply because it was 75 feet above their heads and posed a "theoretical danger" if it fell out of the sky and hit someone. So then we got into a polite but heated discussion about what exactly constitutes "theoretical danger" of drones and I proceeded to tell him that baseball is legal in the public parks and people have been known to be seriously injured by flying bats and baseballs in the history of the United States. So why isn't baseball banned in parks like drones? Luckily I was able to keep my cool and be polite to this Barney Fife tough guy with a badge --- but it clearly illustrates the uphill battle we friendly and educated drone pilots have against the macho guys with guns and badges who think they are all Supreme Court justices with their knowledge of the law.

I don't think that was the case here. This is (was) a major event, World Cup, with attendance of well over 50,000 people. They have a permit, and had to provide a liability insurance policy to the city. The event is world class, professionally managed, and they have the right to request exclusivity. HB Police do NOT make it a policy to harass safe, respectful flyers on a normal day.

 

[Jiggly-Wiggly]

I don't think that was the case here. This is (was) a major event, World Cup, with attendance of well over 50,000 people. They have a permit, and had to provide a liability insurance policy to the city. The event is world class, professionally managed, and they have the right to request exclusivity. HB Police do NOT make it a policy to harass safe, respectful flyers on a normal day.

I guess the main point of my post is that the police need to be more polite and take a lighter approach towards us instead of getting right up in our face and citing fake FAA drone regs just so they can intimidate people enjoying a legal hobby. What is so wrong about a cop just walking up and saying "Hello sir, I respectfully ask you to not fly your drone here today because we have a sanctioned event with a large crowd of people who would rather just focus on the sporting competition. You're welcome to come back and fly when the event is over." There is no need to send an undercover detective to verbally intimidate a drone enthusiast for 15 min. and spout falsehoods about FAA regulations and fines. That just breeds further contempt of police by the law-abiding public, and police don't have a very good PR image as it is.

 

[anotherlab]

I'm curious as to how cops get "educated" about FAA regs and drone laws? I really can't see a bunch of cops sitting in a room getting a very thorough explanation of all current U.S. drone regulations from an FAA expert. Gut feeling tells me their "sarge" just tells them to go home and look up drones on Google and that will suffice for their "legal expertise" in dealing with drone pilots.

I was stopped by a Barney Fife type cop in a small Ohio town last year when I was flying my P3P in a public park. I didnt know RC models were prohibited in all public parks in that particular county, so it was my fault for not knowing the local ordinances. However, what made me angry was his accusation that I was "harassing people" with my drone simply because it was 75 feet above their heads and posed a "theoretical danger" if it fell out of the sky and hit someone. So then we got into a polite but heated discussion about what exactly constitutes "theoretical danger" of drones and I proceeded to tell him that baseball is legal in the public parks and people have been known to be seriously injured by flying bats and baseballs in the history of the United States. So why isn't baseball banned in parks like drones? Luckily I was able to keep my cool and be polite to this Barney Fife tough guy with a badge --- but it clearly illustrates the uphill battle we friendly and educated drone pilots have against the macho guys with guns and badges who think they are all Supreme Court justices with their knowledge of the law.

The problem with your baseball analogy is that you typically don't start up a baseball game around people sitting in a park enjoying their picnic. You usually play in a marked area with bases and only the players are in the field. If you were to start swinging a baseball bat in the middle of a group of people, they would ask you to stop that too.

 

[Jiggly-Wiggly]

The problem with your baseball analogy is that you typically don't start up a baseball game around people sitting in a park enjoying their picnic. You usually play in a marked area with bases and only the players are in the field. If you were to start swinging a baseball bat in the middle of a group of people, they would ask you to stop that too.

Yeah baseball games are played in a specific part of a public park --- but that doesn't mean a baseball can't be hit outside of those areas and strike someone in the face and cause a broken nose, blown out eyeball, or other various head traumas. Same goes with an errant bat that slips out during a swing and hits an innocent bystander.

As far as the noise that a Phantom generates, yeah it does make a loud noise but so do screaming kids, barking dogs, and lawn mowers used by the park maintenance crew. Who has the right to say my Phantom is annoying flying overhead with that noise but barking dogs and screaming brat kids are OK?

Like I told that Barney Fife cop --- all these complaints about drones are subjective. They do pose a "theoretical danger" and do cause noise but many other legal things allowed in parks can cause injury and annoyances to the public. Drone pilots need to use these defenses vigorously!

 

[N017RW]

What defense?
Lands can be designated use and there's nothing to defend.
Get used to it.

 

[Monte55]

I think for the ones that think they should be allowed to fly anywhere, I wonder how they would feel if they arrived home only to find a crowd of people in their yard flying drones, playing yard darts, archery, etc. without permission or regards to safety.

 

[anotherlab]

No, I'm not "getting used to it". Your defeatist attitude is very telling about your character.

Public parks do not own airspace. They can dictate takeoffs and landings for RC aircraft but have ZERO authority of the airspace above their park. That is why I often find a private lot next to a park and takeoff from there because I know there is nothing the park officials or cops can do about it.

As far as putting up a defense, proud and intelligent drone pilots like myself have Constitutional rights like anyone else when it comes to enjoying a legal hobby. I will not kowtow to ignorant and macho law enforcement when they are spouting LIES and FALSEHOODS about drone laws and regulations. STAND YOUR GROUND.

And this is why we can't have nice things.

By your account, you took a hostile stance with the police officer. For what purpose? To prove that you knew more about FAA rules and regulations? The man was just trying to do his job.

When people take the attitude that they have a constitutional right to fly anywhere, we end up with laws completely ban their usage. Legally speaking, drone flying is new ground. Laws are still being worked out. When the laws are written, privacy, trespassing, and public safety will count for more than the FAA's ownership of the air. Right now, we do not have a clear and consistent definition of what that is.

When people take the attitude that only the FAA can say where their drone can be flown, that just forces governments to legislate more control over the sky to local authorities. That's why in the US we are facing the Drone Federalism Act of 2017, Senate bill 1272. Education and working with people will accomplish more than "I will not kowtow to ignorant and macho law enforcement".

 

[BigAl07]

This thread is spiraling into an area we are NOT going to allow. Get back on track, stop the personal attacks, and find ways to debate cordially or you might get a break for a while.