love the new 2X zoom

[John Locke]

I seem to remember that zoom does work also in 3K (3072). Or at least was the case with previous GO4 app version.

Could be useful for some crop edit towards final 1080.

Wonder why nobody mention that zoom works up to 3K, if I'm correct - and my question is: Still no degradation ?

You can still zoom when shooting in 2.7K, but it's not as much zoom power, but it will work. Correct, no degradation, it's a lossless system that crops native pixels. It's very nice to know you have the ability, I use it all the time with animal vids. When zoomed I sometimes find animals in the bush or weeds that I would have never see without zoom.

This feature was never mentioned in the manual because it wasn't available on Android for about a year after P4 release. The Android software team at DJI is not as good as the iOS team IMO. So instead of pissing off all the android users when the P4 came out, they didn't note the feature in the manual. Instead, the beta testers (AKA customers) found this feature almost immediately and spread the word. Eventually the Android team got it working in the Go4 app, but I still don't think this feature is listed in the manual.

 

[RémyHeli]

Thank you John, details much appreciated.

 

[lmmavrick]

Ok, so from a practical perspective if you were to film in 4K you may still enjoy the same resolution in your 1080 rendered output with the luxury of changing your crop in post. You could still use the zoom function to aid In framing your shot.

my pc can't handle 4k and i can't afford to spend the thousands it will take to up grade . since 1080 is still in large use it's the way i go for now . i hear what your saying though

 

[John Locke]

Personally I can’t see why I might chose to record at anything below the potential of the equipment.

Here are some reasons:
1. Because if you record 4K you can't use 2X ZOOM during flight to see things closer.
2. Your disk fills up 4X faster with 4K files.
3. If the pilot has no 4X viewing capability, he can't even inspect the resulting 4K video if he did edit in 4K.
4. If you only render 1080 today, but record 4K (to so-call future proof), odds are 99.9% you'll never come back and use 4K video and render to 4K. The file will simply occupy 4X the disk space for nothing.

Are there times I wished I had recorded 4K? Yes. However I don't lose any sleep over it. My resulting 1080 video content offers plenty of HD resolution to enjoy, as it's the composition, cinematic moves and video content that matters most.

Another problem with 4K in my case is it's temperamental. It requires the only the best SD's. Maybe there's something wrong with my camera, but I don't suspect others have this problem also. Here's the story:

I have about 8 cards of 32GB U3 SDs, and and a few 64GB U3s. The problem is some of the 32GB U3 cards work with 4K and others don't. The bad ones will start to record, then a minute or two later the camera beeps and stops recording out of the blue. Another problem that occurs, when shooting I've had cases that the cameras write to the SD and creates what appears to be a normal large file, as if everything is OK. But when you get home the files are corrupt, they won't open, the player and editor cannot play the video. Whole clips are trash. Imagine that happening to you on an important shoot. This doesn't happen with 1080 using the same U3 32GB SD cards, it only happens when shooting 4K (3840X2160). Now I have to mark the cards that work with 4K, otherwise I'll have stops and/or corrupted files in captures, ruining things in a big way. That's a PITA, not to mention I've gotta spend another $100 on more SD cards, just to support 4K. Just a PITA. After discovering this recently I'll likely have to give my bad SDs away to be re-purposed for other things.

 

[With The Birds]

Here are some reasons:
1. Because if you record 4K you can't use 2X ZOOM during flight to see things closer.
2. Your disk fills up 4X faster with 4K files.
3. If the pilot has no 4X viewing capability, he can't even inspect the resulting 4K video if he did edit in 4K.
4. If you only render 1080 today, but record 4K (to so-call future proof), odds are 99.9% you'll never come back and use 4K video and render to 4K. The file will simply occupy 4X the disk space for nothing.

Are there times I wished I had recorded 4K? Yes. However I don't lose any sleep over it. My resulting 1080 video content offers plenty of HD resolution to enjoy, as it's the composition, cinematic moves and video content that matters most.

Another problem with 4K in my case is it's temperamental. It requires the only the best SD's. Maybe there's something wrong with my camera, but I don't suspect others have this problem also. Here's the story:

I have a about 8 cards of 32GB U3 SDs, and and a few 64GB U3s. The problem is some of the 32GB U3 cards work with 4K and others don't. The bad ones will start to record, then a minute or two later the camera beeps and stops recording out of the blue. Another problem that occurs, when shooting I've had cases that the cameras write to the SD and creates what appears to be a normal large file, as if everything is OK. But when you get home the files are corrupt, they won't open, the player and editor cannot play the video. Whole clips are trash. Imagine that happening to you on an important shoot. This doesn't happen with 1080 using the same U3 32GB SD cards, it only happens when shooting 4K (3840X2160). Now I have to mark the cards that work with 4K, otherwise I'll have stops and/or corrupted files in captures, ruining things in a big way. That's a PITA, not to mention I've gotta spend another $100 on more SD cards, just to support 4K. Just a PITA. After discovering this recently I'll likely have to give my bad SDs away to be re-purposed for other things.

You have explained YOUR reasons for preferring 1080, I don’t experience the limitations you have identified so 4K or higher makes more sense for MY purposes.

I know people who shoot JPEG exclusively in preference to RAW on pro spec DSLR gear for reasons of storage and processing capability. Whatever works for them is important.

You might’be the guy who is arguing 4K is all that is required when 8K is the emerging tech- who knows. It doesn’t matter. Whatever works for you. I think anyone who buys a TV now will get a 4K display, even my projector in my theatre is 4K now, there is no way I will default to 1080 if I have a choice, that’s my usage case.

Just cos it is best for you doesn’t mean it suits everyone.

 

[John Locke]

You might’be the guy who is arguing 4K is all that is required when 8K is the emerging tech

That's funny, and you're probably right! Since I'll have my fancy new computer this week, 4K will be less of a problem, like you. Until the internet speeds up a lot more, 8K may be like 3D TV, here today, gone tomorrow (for consumers). I see 8K targeted more for commercial use near-term, less for home for years, but that's just my opinion. I may be wrong, but I don't see 8K dominant in homes for at least 10yrs, maybe 15. Not because it's impossible, but because the content distribution is more difficult. You really need fiber to stream 4K today, 8K also, and less than 10% in the US have fiber to their neighborhood. I don't see satellite ever being able to stream 4K, but I hope I'm wrong.

 

[Helihover]

Digital zoom = lost quality. No matter how you look at it. No if's and's or but's

Optical zoom is the only way to properly zoom. Or position the camera physically closer.

One could crop 4k and render in 1080 without loss.

If you digital zoom a still, your simply cropping the pic.

 

[With The Birds]

Digital zoom = lost quality. No matter how you look at it. No if's and's or but's

Optical zoom is the only way to properly zoom. Or position the camera physically closer.

One could crop 4k and render in 1080 without loss.

If you digital zoom a still, your simply cropping the pic.

Yep. It’s a native pixel crop at the same resolution as what you might expect to produce cropping in post. I can’t see the point in throwing pixels away, I might need them later to get a better image/video. If you have no need for greater than 1080 and a need to be further from your subject and happy with the out of camera framing it’s lossless.

 

[KDCypP4Adv]

Can anyone tell me whether the P4advanced has the zoom facility please?

 

[Bad Andy]

Digital zoom = lost quality. No matter how you look at it. No if's and's or but's

Optical zoom is the only way to properly zoom. Or position the camera physically closer.

One could crop 4k and render in 1080 without loss.

If you digital zoom a still, your simply cropping the pic.

Well, lost potential resolution, anyway, if it's just cropping.

There is one benefit to the cropping "zoom" that I don't think anyone here has pointed out yet... Auto-exposure won't base its setting on parts of the image outside the area of interest.

 

[mark99]

It wont change the prospective of the objects filmed, that is the main issue, 20mm is about useless for movie filming for anything except ultra wide scene setting.
offering a 37mm lens option as well as the standard 20mm gold fish bowl would see many opt for the more realistic version.
There is talk of interchangeable lenses on the P5 if they can ever get it out.
But looking at the grinding to a halt of technology at DJI p range, I doubt we will see it for another 12 months at least.

 

[John Locke]

Can anyone tell me whether the P4advanced has the zoom facility please?

No it doesn't. DJI hasn't created the firmware to do that with the 1" sensor yet.

 

[KDCypP4Adv]

No it doesn't. DJI hasn't created the firmware to do that with the 1" sensor yet.

Thanks for your confirmation, it’s what I feared and is a shame as one of my reasons for buying the drone is to check out any local smoke for an unattended fire as I live near a forest and there’s some pretty reckless fire starters here. Sometimes I can’t see the smoke without my P4A being so close to a house that they may think I’m stalking them which I don’t want to do unless they do have an unattended fire lol

 

[u000gbk]

Yes, a great feature that doesn't exist on P4P yet!. This zoom feature has been out since the P4 was released Mar 2016 on iOS, I use it all the time. For over a year it wasn't available on Android Go4, but zoom is supported now on Android for about 6mos now I think. I don't think Litchi supports this yet.

John - any idea when it will be available for P4P+?

 

[John Locke]

John - any idea when it will be available for P4P+?

DJI won't say. I'll be asking them at every show I see them at. I encourage others to do the same. I presume when DJI supports the real time crop/2Xzoom scheme for the 1" sensor in 1080 (same as P4 and Mavic), it should be released on the P4P, P4A, P4P+, P4A+, P4PO and Inspire X4 camera at the same time. However, if DJI repeats history, this feature will be available on iOS first and a year later they'll release the Android version.

Your use case is a good example of the utility of seeing things closer while flying, minimizing how close you get to the POI. I use it all the time for animal clips to minimize the animal's noise and fear of getting stung by a swarm of bees, which is likely what they think they are hearing when I approach.

 

[MADrone]

I’ll add that I am now going back to my older 4K videos and generating short clips in 4K for Getty Images... I couldn’t do that if I shot the original in 1080.

 

[GadgetGuy]

Many people jump to conclusions about DJI's "lossless zoom" and miss the point. Zoom is very helpful for the average Phantom pilot. Please realize that many pilots don't record 4K because it's such a hassle to edit on mid range computers (creating proxies, etc) for the average person. Capturing in 1080 is fine for many folks, easy to edit, takes 1/4 the disk space, and in most cases 4K is simply not needed. Many times 1080 resolution is all they can view anyway.

When shooting 1080 you can enjoy the 2X zoom WHILE FLYING to SEE THINGS CLOSER without having to fly closer. There is NO DEGRADATION in the 1080 capture since it's cropping native pixels, not enlarging them. This is highly useful when capturing animals so you don't scare them, or shots you simply feel uncomfortable getting closer. Seeing things twice as close WHILE FLYING helps to spot things you would otherwise miss without ZOOM. As a result you can decide to spend more time capturing these discoveries, things would have normally missed with no ZOOM. POST EDIT can't help with what you've missed, so it's not the "same effect". If you don't take the opportunity to ZOOM in to get a closer look, you'll miss things that you wish you had seen and spent more time capturing.

If you're recording in 1080, the 2X zoom resolution is LOSSLESS, you are cropping native pixels, not enlarging them, as many assume or imply. IMO some pilots are too snooty and negative on this issue, and totally miss the irreplaceable "real time" utility of the 2X zoom which works great on P4 and Mavic. I miss this feature on P4P, as DJI hasn't done the firmware to support this yet on the 1" sensor.

Buyers of the P4P are wasting the P4P advantages by shooting in 1080p. It was designed for 100mbs 4K. Perhaps that is why they didn't bother to include it. Kind of like buying an automatic shift on a sports car, if you ask me.
Since your FPV is of such low quality at 720p, best to shoot in 4K and do your cropping from a 4x larger capture in post on a 27" 4K monitor where you will really see what you captured!

 

[GadgetGuy]

Here are some reasons:
1. Because if you record 4K you can't use 2X ZOOM during flight to see things closer.
2. Your disk fills up 4X faster with 4K files.
3. If the pilot has no 4X viewing capability, he can't even inspect the resulting 4K video if he did edit in 4K.
4. If you only render 1080 today, but record 4K (to so-call future proof), odds are 99.9% you'll never come back and use 4K video and render to 4K. The file will simply occupy 4X the disk space for nothing.

Are there times I wished I had recorded 4K? Yes. However I don't lose any sleep over it. My resulting 1080 video content offers plenty of HD resolution to enjoy, as it's the composition, cinematic moves and video content that matters most.

Another problem with 4K in my case is it's temperamental. It requires the only the best SD's. Maybe there's something wrong with my camera, but I don't suspect others have this problem also. Here's the story:

I have about 8 cards of 32GB U3 SDs, and and a few 64GB U3s. The problem is some of the 32GB U3 cards work with 4K and others don't. The bad ones will start to record, then a minute or two later the camera beeps and stops recording out of the blue. Another problem that occurs, when shooting I've had cases that the cameras write to the SD and creates what appears to be a normal large file, as if everything is OK. But when you get home the files are corrupt, they won't open, the player and editor cannot play the video. Whole clips are trash. Imagine that happening to you on an important shoot. This doesn't happen with 1080 using the same U3 32GB SD cards, it only happens when shooting 4K (3840X2160). Now I have to mark the cards that work with 4K, otherwise I'll have stops and/or corrupted files in captures, ruining things in a big way. That's a PITA, not to mention I've gotta spend another $100 on more SD cards, just to support 4K. Just a PITA. After discovering this recently I'll likely have to give my bad SDs away to be re-purposed for other things.

Your issue with 3840x2160 4K recording is unique to your aircraft. I have not experienced any such issues across all varieties of microSD card brands and sizes, and have always recorded in 4K since the P3P.

 

[Russ43Phantom]

I agree ... to each his own. As one who is a photography enthusiast, I prefer using the full capability of a lens and crop later. As far as machine horesepower goes, I remember in the 80’s/90’s when I had a top of line Thinkpad laptop that cost $5k. Given that experience, I feel today’s high speed processors and memory are cheap. Admittedly, when doing 4k video, a 40 TB raid disk drive becomes a necessary expense that many don’t really need. Then 1080 formats are fine.

 

[Andy9]

If we are talking about photography, it is always better to have as much pixels as you can. You can hardly crop the 1080p image because the quality goes very low, while at 4K you can easily afford yourself that. The quality of 4K image is good, almost the same as if captured with a quality DSLR. And even the picture quality of 4K video snapshots is acceptable.

At video 4K and 2K makes almost no noticable difference on 17 or 19i monitors. And almost all of the people watch HD size video. andy if you don't have a 4K monitor you can not see the 4K quality at all !
I have 24i monitor and it is completely the same if I play 1080 or 4K video when the monitor is set to HD res. If I switch to 4K res. than the difference is quite obvious.
Maybe it is wise to capture video in 4K and then render it in 1080 res, and have 4K version saved if you might use it some day.