Gimbal Breaking By Design?

[MapMaker53]

But maybe someone can offer a theory as to why DJI would pressure a seller not to sell a cheap fix that keeps their fragile gimbal from separating.

Easy answer - it prevents adverse publicity (marketing) that could impact on sales :roll: DUH !

And anyone with common sense knows that manufacturers reduce prices in order to sell MORE of the item and increase profit through a greater volume of sales.

Somewhat simplistic - that argument doesn't take into account profit margins. You'd need hard numbers to prove that one.
Also given the global economic collapse, manufacturers are desperate to stay afloat and so are cutting prices, having (permanent) sales etc.

I agree that the gimbal fix creates adverse publicity by featuring the gimbal's design fault. And it also reduces their service department profits. Which was my original point.

 

[msinger]

And anyone with common sense knows that manufacturers reduce prices in order to sell MORE of the item and increase profit through a greater volume of sales.

Hmm... Apple certainly doesn't know this trick of price it low and sell more. They price everything high and still have no trouble selling MORE.

 

[MapMaker53]

So you are saying that Apple never drops there prices on their products? Seriously? Come on.
http://www.bestbuy.com/site/apple-m...203c120&ksprof_id=8&ksaffcode=3499&ksdevice=c

 

[msinger]

Oh, you know what I'm saying.

I suppose we should get back on topic here though. Debunked rumors are much more fun to discuss

 

[MapMaker53]

I agree. Unfortunately, it's still a fact regarding the seller. An unproven fact to others, which I understand, but one that I personally have been told by the seller to be true. This is basically just a stalemate. Again, I simply posted the information I had received and theorized about it. Members can believe me or not believe me to whatever extent they like. I just find it very interesting that DJI wants the seller to stop selling his bracket. I also wonder if the sellers of other bracket versions have been contacted by DJI with the same demand.

I think I should clear something up so that there is no misunderstanding here. I'm not pissed off because my Phantom's gimbal came apart or ribbon broke, because that never has happened. I'm not pissed off that DJI hasn't bothered to fix the problem with a simple bracket on their latest P2V+ model upgrade. I'm not pissed off that the gimbal is so delicate that it easily flies apart on impact -- because I understand that the Phantom is a delicate instrument and is not a toy. And I'm not even pissed that DJI charges $900 to repair/replace a broken gimbal. What I find atrocious is that DJI is attempting to eliminate an easy fix for all of us.

 

[DownunderPhantom]

I find it interesting that DJI chose not to incorporate the simple gimbal bracket onto the upgraded P2V+. Clearly, they have been well aware of the problem and know how to solve it (as we all do) by adding an inexpensive bracket. Yet they didn't bother solving the problem. I have also learned from a reliable source that DJI has contacted at least one seller of the bracket and told them to stop selling it. Seems to me that DJI is actually counting on our P2V+ gimbals to eventually rip apart upon relatively low impact so that we must turn to them for an additional $900 repair that goes right into their pockets. It's ironic that a Chinese company is pressuring others to not make accessories for their product when historically China has never honored others' patents or copyrights. It seems to me that DJI, in this case, has chosen to be a company that is simply interested in profit over quality and is intentionally perpetuating a problem that will bring it additional profit, above and beyond the initial purchase price, at the expense of their loyal and enthusiastic customers. Why else would they make any replacement camera ribbons so scarce, not incorporate the simple fix into the upgrade, and demand that sellers of the gimbal bracket guards stop selling them? Personally, I do not trust a company that does that type of thing.

Have you noticed that there have been very few problems with the gimbal wth people who have not had hard landings or crashes. Seems to me that DJI have designed the gimbal to act as a stabilizing device for the camera and not an armoured titanium device to withstand impacts.

I have a very expensive video camera (one that you hold) and if I dropped it and something broke on it I would not go after the manufacturer saying that it was a poor design, it would be my fault and would expect to pay for the repair.

 

[MapMaker53]

I absolutely agree. Like I said, it is a delicate instrument and should be treated as one, and it is reasonable to expect it may break with any abrupt impact or rough handling just like any other delicate scientific instrument. It is totally the operators fault if it breaks. (No sarcasm there.) But for DJI to tell a seller (according to what was told to me) to stop manufacturing a cheap accessory that adds a bit of reinforcement that has a good chance of averting a $900 repair suggests, to me, that they must have a reason for keeping that inexpensive break-away mitigating accessory out of our hands and prefer their break-away design to remain exactly as it is -- bracket free.

 

[Jstic]

Wow.. someone is expending a huge amount of energy trying to defend DJI. Unfortunately, nothing said here changes the fact that I was told first-hand by a seller that DJI told him to stop selling his gimbal bracket.

LOL, it was you who started the thread and has spent far more energy bashing DJI with false and unsubstantiated rumors, one of which has been disproved already. Do you work for Walkera or another DJI competitor?

Let me be blunt here because obviously you don't live in the real world. As far as your claim that DJI is calling a gimbal bracket maker and telling him/her to stop selling them, that is total ******** until you can prove it. It is an unsubstantiated rumor that you have chosen to spread, because you are admittedly pissed off at DJI. If you can't prove it, it didn't happen. Even if DJI did make contact with a gimbal bracket maker, which I doubt, there is probably a lot more to it than what you are posting. I would think the gimbal bracket maker would be only too eager to publicize this alleged contact with DJI, it would prove that his bracket is necessary and that DJI recognizes that, increase publicity for him and increase sales. Your conspiracy theory about DJI holding back on parts to drive up profits was debunked yesterday when DJI began offering the cables at a substantial discount below aftermarket cables. Now you want us to believe another rumor.

You don't understand the physics or mechanics of the gimbal separation problem, so you see the gimbal bracket as a fix, which it is not. It is a band-aid for the problem, addressing the symptom and not the cause. As I said earlier, the only thing these brackets to is, in some cases, stop the total separation of the rear motor and shaft and the tearing of the cable, which now can be bought for $25. THEY DO NOT PREVENT A REPAIR BILL. Gimbal bracket or not, repeated or sharp lateral force will cause the shaft to loosen in the housing. The gimbal then has to be taken apart and repaired properly. I have yet to see a gimbal bracket maker claim that his bracket prevents the shaft/motor loosening problem. I'm not suggesting anyone remove their gimbal bracket, or stop buying them, I am simply stating the facts. But to infer that DJI should incorporate this into a redesign of their camera/gimbal, or are not doing that deliberately is just ridiculous. To go even further and speculate that they designed their gimbal to fail (look at the title of this thread) is worse. If they are going to spend time and money on an expensive redesign, they would probably address the cause of the problem.

Now I have to go because I have a date with 3 french models. I can't tell you their names, but trust me, I'm an honorable guy like you claim to be and would never start a false rumor. Remember, "they can't put anything on the internet that isn't true. I heard that on the internet." :roll:

 

[locoworks]

the gimbal needs a redesign with a bolt and nylock nut, it wouldn't be so bad if it seperated and instead of a ribbon cable to tear there was a series of tracks and wipers to conduct signals and power so it was designed to let go on purpose. another option would be to drill and tap a 2mm thread on the joint between shaft and gimbal casting and put a screw in? it would act like a keyway for rotational issues and stop fore and aft movement too. i don't understand ( other than cost ) why a gimbal with a 2 pivot points on all axis isn't used so it can't actually seperate at all. it wouldn't matter if the camera wasn't pivoted so the centre of the lens was the pivot point because at the distances we use the thing the lens moving in a slight arc wouldn't be an issue.

 

[MapMaker53]

I agree, locoworks. I'm sure often a design is used and in hindsight it is realized that a different design would have been better. I don't fault DJI for that. But once they are aware of the problem, they can't also pressure a seller not to sell a potential fix without putting themselves into that "breaking by design" category, IMO. The title also had a question mark for everyone to come to their own conclusion.

LOL, it was you who started the thread and has spent far more energy bashing DJI with false and unsubstantiated rumors, one of which has been disproved already. Do you work for Walkera or another DJI competitor?

Let me be blunt here because obviously you don't live in the real world. As far as your claim that DJI is calling a gimbal bracket maker and telling him/her to stop selling them, that is total ******** until you can prove it. It is an unsubstantiated rumor that you have chosen to spread, because you are admittedly pissed off at DJI. If you can't prove it, it didn't happen. Even if DJI did make contact with a gimbal bracket maker, which I doubt, there is probably a lot more to it than what you are posting. I would think the gimbal bracket maker would be only too eager to publicize this alleged contact with DJI, it would prove that his bracket is necessary and that DJI recognizes that, increase publicity for him and increase sales. Your conspiracy theory about DJI holding back on parts to drive up profits was debunked yesterday when DJI began offering the cables at a substantial discount below aftermarket cables. Now you want us to believe another rumor.

You don't understand the physics or mechanics of the gimbal separation problem, so you see the gimbal bracket as a fix, which it is not. It is a band-aid for the problem, addressing the symptom and not the cause. As I said earlier, the only thing these brackets to is, in some cases, stop the total separation of the rear motor and shaft and the tearing of the cable, which now can be bought for $25. THEY DO NOT PREVENT A REPAIR BILL. Gimbal bracket or not, repeated or sharp lateral force will cause the shaft to loosen in the housing. The gimbal then has to be taken apart and repaired properly. I have yet to see a gimbal bracket maker claim that his bracket prevents the shaft/motor loosening problem. I'm not suggesting anyone remove their gimbal bracket, or stop buying them, I am simply stating the facts. But to infer that DJI should incorporate this into a redesign of their camera/gimbal, or are not doing that deliberately is just ridiculous. To go even further and speculate that they designed their gimbal to fail (look at the title of this thread) is worse. If they are going to spend time and money on an expensive redesign, they would probably address the cause of the problem.

Now I have to go because I have a date with 3 french models. I can't tell you their names, but trust me, I'm an honorable guy like you claim to be and would never start a false rumor. Remember, "they can't put anything on the internet that isn't true. I heard that on the internet." :roll:

Well thaaaank goodness. I can remove my gimbal bracket now that someone who claims Apple never reduces their prices has told me that the gimbal won't prevent a repair bill -- right after also claiming that it is far too difficult for anyone to replace the ribbon themselves. You change your argument whichever way suits you. See, again.. All that energy and anger defending DJI. It's a little over the top, don't you think? I'm just reporting what I was told and you can make fun of me being an honest person if you like, but it doesn't change what I was told. I can't report here something a seller told me just because you demand I tell you who the seller is? I'm really trying to take the high road here and refrain from using terms like "forum police wannabee" but you're really making that difficult. It's simple.. believe me or don't believe me. I don't care which you choose. It doesn't change what I was told. Like I said, if DJI wants to find out who in their organization is pressuring this seller not to sell the bracket, I'll be happy to get them in touch with him. Am I an advocate for using a gimbal bracket "bandaid"? Hell ya. Am I promoting any particular one here? No. I have not mentioned a brand in this thread nor will I. I even received a PM inquiry yesterday from a member of the forum asking which bracket was the one I was referring to because he wanted to protect his gimbal. I simply gave him the three types/websites that I know of in no particular order and told him each one probably works as well as the other. Might be hard for some people to believe, but I was raised to be an honest person. It's too bad the whole world isn't that way.

 

[msinger]

I'm just reporting what I was told

No, you're really just here to start a wild rumor. You've provided no information to back up anything you've said.

 

[MapMaker53]

I understand that it is a "wild rumor" to you, but I know it to be the truth. I don't care if you don't believe me. And the more you keep calling me a liar, the more posts this thread gets of me telling you that you actually happen to be wrong. Keep it going.

 

[msinger]

I never called you a liar. There is no truth to your rumor until you can provide information to back up what you're saying.

 

[rbhamilton]

I believe we need to cut the tension with a bit of humor... Conan?

 

[Prylar Bek]

almost can guarantee that with the announcement that Gopro is going enter the drone space their bird will take into the weak link regards to crashes and their aftermath.They do a lot of R&D and they have 'gone to school' at DJ's expense. Cant wait

 

[MapMaker53]

I never called you a liar. There is no truth to your rumor until you can provide information to back up what you're saying.

The truth always exists, even when there is no proof for those who choose not to believe it. Man, that's deep.

 

[phantomi]

Now I can see why the more robust Vision Non + wasn't upgraded and maybe discontinued. Mine has two unprofitable crashes for dji. :lol:

 

[msinger]

MapMaker53, thanks for continuing to confirm my conclusion. Rumor debunked for sure