My thoughts on breaking the rules.

[Rod Cambridge]

In my experience, there are those that want rules, and those that don't. Those that do, claim there will be chaos, and that scares them. They are ruled by fear.

I will not be enslaved by your fear.

 

[Neon Euc]

In my experience, there are those that want rules, and those that don't. Those that do, claim there will be chaos, and that scares them. They are ruled by fear.

I will not be enslaved by your fear.

Well said [emoji4]

Neon Euc

 

[AlecW]

In my experience, there are those that want rules, and those that don't. Those that do, claim there will be chaos, and that scares them. They are ruled by fear.

I will not be enslaved by your fear.

Within reason. If there were no rules of the road for example would you want to drive 70MPH +?

 

[Jim49]

Hi everyone, Just wanted to express some thoughts on much of what I've been reading lately. I'm a new P4P owner and almost at a point where I'm sorry that I invested the money into this hobby because of what may come in the future. First off, this site has been great and everyone has been so helpful whenever you have a technical issue or can't figure something out. What is bugging me is that many are posting things they have done or want to try and do and they know it's against the rules or they know it's pushing the issue. For example this guy.
Anyone thought about doing this....
Not saying he did it, but obviously the thought is in his mind. People wanting to fly near airports, break the 400 ft rule, flying over events and stadiums and crowds etc.... The list goes on. There are millions of areas you can fly, be safe and not either get in trouble or piss someone off. What this is creating is an anger towards drones from the general public and worse is to make the FAA create more rules, regulations and get things to a point where you won't be able to fly anywhere other than your back yard. I work in aviation and have had a close call in a helicopter where some idiot with a drone was well within the restricted airspace near the airport and well over 400 ft. Then, you see people post their illegal flights they have done and then wine when law enforcement comes and takes their equipment and slaps them with huge FAA fines etc. well hello, you deserve what's coming to you. I'm just asking that we all think first so what hopefully has been a fun hobby so far doesn't get ruined. Would gladly like to hear anyone else's thoughts.

Hi everyone, Just wanted to express some thoughts on much of what I've been reading lately. I'm a new P4P owner and almost at a point where I'm sorry that I invested the money into this hobby because of what may come in the future. First off, this site has been great and everyone has been so helpful whenever you have a technical issue or can't figure something out. What is bugging me is that many are posting things they have done or want to try and do and they know it's against the rules or they know it's pushing the issue. For example this guy.
Anyone thought about doing this....
Not saying he did it, but obviously the thought is in his mind. People wanting to fly near airports, break the 400 ft rule, flying over events and stadiums and crowds etc.... The list goes on. There are millions of areas you can fly, be safe and not either get in trouble or piss someone off. What this is creating is an anger towards drones from the general public and worse is to make the FAA create more rules, regulations and get things to a point where you won't be able to fly anywhere other than your back yard. I work in aviation and have had a close call in a helicopter where some idiot with a drone was well within the restricted airspace near the airport and well over 400 ft. Then, you see people post their illegal flights they have done and then wine when law enforcement comes and takes their equipment and slaps them with huge FAA fines etc. well hello, you deserve what's coming to you. I'm just asking that we all think first so what hopefully has been a fun hobby so far doesn't get ruined. Would gladly like to hear anyone else's thoughts.

 

[Jim49]

Ya there are intentional abusers. But in my area there are very limited flight zones. I think that height should 100 ft from 3-5 miles from airports. I was stopped by a park ranger for flying at 300 ft yet private planes were doing low level fly over in the same area

 

[Neon Euc]

Within reason. If there were no rules of the road for example would you want to drive 70MPH +?

Only if my ex was standing in the middle of the road [emoji16][emoji16][emoji16][emoji16][emoji16]

Neon Euc

 

[blackcrusader]

There are rules in every country. I live in Taiwan. In the capital city Taipei there is a 60m max height limit and there are many no go areas including the Presidents Palace, the airport, and several other areas. In Sun Moon Lake droning is forbidden after some twat flew a drone into a woman's head and injured her in a stupidly low level pass.

Now where I live is in the mountains in Alishan. We also have the Alishan National Park and the Yushan National Park. In both of these places I am allowed to fly. In fact I have had the park police view in amazement the video and photo's I am able to take after clearing through clouds to get some stunning sunsets & sunrises flying at above 10000 ft.

I am not flying over people in these locations as I fly away from the car parking areas into the valleys around a mile away from the mountains. After all you don't want to crash into them in the fog lol. The footage I take is also provided to my local government and I allow them to use it for promoting the area. For a price of course

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[10X]

I couldn't get past the first page of this thread. Hopefully all the fear mongers moved on & the thread got better.
I'm not sure what they are so worried about. The FAA is easing the commercial drone use regulations, but folks are still worried about more regulations. I also didn't know there were so many that thought it's their job to police the hobby. Too bad the Berlin Wall fell & these same people can't move to East Germany. I'm sure they would be great advocates of the Stasi.

 

[dirkclod]

I couldn't get past the first page of this thread. Hopefully all the fear mongers moved on & the thread got better.
I'm not sure what they are so worried about. The FAA is easing the commercial drone use regulations, but folks are still worried about more regulations. I also didn't know there were so many that thought it's their job to police the hobby. Too bad the Berlin Wall fell & these same people can't move to East Germany. I'm sure they would be great advocates of the Stasi.

Oh no, go back and read it all . Not fair to jump in without reading it all .

 

[ukphantomclub]

You can't stop people breaking the rules, end off. People are people especially those who want to ban drones altogether, will buy one (cheap and cheerful) and break the rules to help create new ones,until they are band completely.

Me I follow the rules to the letter, but sometimes wonder if I am breaking the rules, because flying off a hill, which is at 400ft or more, will effectively break the rules, will it not, as the land around it is flat, so am I breaking the rules?

That's why creating a flying club helps to prevent irresponsible or ignorant people from breaking the rules. That's how the RC fix wind guys do it, and I believe thats how we should do it too.

UKphantomclub.webs.com is trying to do exactly this!

 

[Dan Peters]

Hi everyone, Just wanted to express some thoughts on much of what I've been reading lately. I'm a new P4P owner and almost at a point where I'm sorry that I invested the money into this hobby because of what may come in the future. First off, this site has been great and everyone has been so helpful whenever you have a technical issue or can't figure something out. What is bugging me is that many are posting things they have done or want to try and do and they know it's against the rules or they know it's pushing the issue. For example this guy.
Anyone thought about doing this....
Not saying he did it, but obviously the thought is in his mind. People wanting to fly near airports, break the 400 ft rule, flying over events and stadiums and crowds etc.... The list goes on. There are millions of areas you can fly, be safe and not either get in trouble or piss someone off. What this is creating is an anger towards drones from the general public and worse is to make the FAA create more rules, regulations and get things to a point where you won't be able to fly anywhere other than your back yard. I work in aviation and have had a close call in a helicopter where some idiot with a drone was well within the restricted airspace near the airport and well over 400 ft. Then, you see people post their illegal flights they have done and then wine when law enforcement comes and takes their equipment and slaps them with huge FAA fines etc. well hello, you deserve what's coming to you. I'm just asking that we all think first so what hopefully has been a fun hobby so far doesn't get ruined. Would gladly like to hear anyone else's thoughts.

I couldn't agree more!! If you cannot follow easy to follow rules then please find another sport.

 

[HoboDan]

I think cameras just piss people off in general. If drones didn't have a camera on them, then I suspect the public wouldn't be as alarmed about them flying around. No more than someone flying an RC aircraft around the neighborhood or an RC car racing down the street. The interim mayor of Huntington Beach, CA brought up the instance of a drone flying over his backyard pool area and it "Made him mad enough he wanted to slap it out of the sky" so they were hunting out ordinances so the police could arrest drone operators.

Imagine driving by someone standing on the corner with a large DSLR camera and telephoto lens pointing it at you and everyone going by. If it were on a tripod it might even make you more uneasy. It would probably make you angry as well. I had that happen once and it did make me wonder what the heck the guy was doing and maybe enough to go back and confront him about it.

But people will always break laws. Can't fire off gun in the city either, yet my neighbor will sometimes pump off a few shotgun rounds at night for whatever reason. Close enough I can hear the pump action too. Some people do not care about laws and seem to enjoy breaking them.

Tell the mayor to look at all intersections in this country.... if your lucky, there will only be 4 cameras watching you. That is what this world is all about now...

 

[Tenly]

You can't stop people breaking the rules, end off. People are people especially those who want to ban drones altogether, will buy one (cheap and cheerful) and break the rules to help create new ones,until they are band completely.

Me I follow the rules to the letter, but sometimes wonder if I am breaking the rules, because flying off a hill, which is at 400ft or more, will effectively break the rules, will it not, as the land around it is flat, so am I breaking the rules?

You don't follow the rules to the letter by your own admission. The rule is maximum 400' above ground level - so yes, you would be breaking the rules if you take off from the top of a hill and then fly away from the hill.

People breaking the rules does not result in more rules. It results in more enforcement of the existing rules and perhaps stiffer penalties. If people are already breaking the existing rules, what good would more rules do? Why would they be needed?

People doing stupid and dangerous things while still operating within the existing rules is what will result in more rules. A good example of this is your feigned confusion about whether taking off from high ground and then flying away from it is a violation or not.

It should be obvious to anyone smart enough to operate a drone that 400' above ground level refers to the current position of the drone and not from the drones starting point.

If enough people pretended to misunderstand that - that would be a reason why they might change the wording of the rules to make that point more clear.


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[That Cicero Guy]

I am studying for the Part 107 certification and I went from having a goal of flying a drone commercially on the side to being so engulfed in this world that I'm now in the process of applying to go back to school for it here in IL. I'm fortunate enough to not live too far from a University (Lewis) which has its own airport and FAA sanctioned flight and unmanned aerial systems degree. 2 months ago, I had never heard of a sectional chart, NOTAM, etc.

That being said, I was a bit cynical about all the rules, even though I understood why there are so many, but after living in study guides and online courses, learning airspace and all the other pilot "stuff", I respect it 100 times more. I think if people took the time to learn and understand the airspace system, they would understand the rules and regulations much more as far as why there are so many. I use KittyHawk & ForeFlight to check airspace and I'm making my own list of local class G airspace areas I can fly. I also check city and county ordinances because most of them can be found online for drone use.

Drones are not toys. They FAA considers them aircraft, and I think so should everybody else.

If you doubt the importance of regulations, watch this quad copter take off the winglet of a Southwest 737 during a landing approach at the beginning of this video. This is why the rules are important:

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As somebody in this thread stated, if you don't want to follow the rules and/or respect them, you should find another hobby.... A drone can literally take a life in the perfect storm situation, just like driving a car. You have to respect that fact. If you think that's being paranoid or over-cautious, then be prepared for the consequences of your actions if you push your luck with them. [emoji111]️


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[dirkclod]

Sorry bro but that scene you speak of is faked.

 

[joet]

Sorry bro but that scene you speak of is faked.

Indeed: Southwest Airlines deals with fake video of a drone not hitting a Southwest Airline jet | Airlines | Dallas News

 

[Tenly]

I am studying for the Part 107 certification and I went from having a goal of flying a drone commercially on the side to being so engulfed in this world that I'm now in the process of applying to go back to school for it here in IL. I'm fortunate enough to not live too far from a University (Lewis) which has its own airport and FAA sanctioned flight and unmanned aerial systems degree. 2 months ago, I had never heard of a sectional chart, NOTAM, etc.

That being said, I was a bit cynical about all the rules, even though I understood why there were there, but after living in study guides and online courses, learning airspace and all the other pilot "stuff", I respect it 100 times more. I think if people took the time to learn and understand the airspace system, they would understand the rules and regulations much more as far as why there are so many. I use KittyHaw & ForeFlight to check airspace and I'm making my own list of local class G airspace areas I can fly. I also check city and county ordinances because most of them can be found online for drone use.

Drones are not toys. They FAA considers them aircraft, and I think so should everybody else.

If you doubt the importance of regulations, watch this quad copter take off the winglet of a Southwest 737 during a landing approach at the beginning of this video. This is why the rules are important:

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As somebody in this thread stated, if you don't want to follow the rules and/or respect them, you should find another hobby.... A drone can literally take a life in the perfect storm situation, just like driving a car. You have to respect that fact. If you think that's being paranoid or over-cautious, then be prepared for the consequences of your actions if you push your luck with them. [emoji111]️


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I don't want to trivialize your post because I'm in favour of reasonable rules regarding the operation of a drone. But you posted a video and claim that it's proof that "the rules are important".

But at best - it's only proof that SOME of the rules are important. It does nothing to prove that ALL of the rules are important.

Labelling an entire region as a no-fly zone is a catch-all that eliminates a lot of activities that are not dangerous to the general public and could even create more danger for specific individuals. A good example of this would be a roofer who wants to use a drone for roof inspections. He only needs to fly 20' above the roof of a house to get the video/photos he would need in order to determine whether there is an obvious problem that should be addressed - but because the house he has been hired to inspect is within 2 miles of an airport - the rules say that he can't do that. So he's forced to get on a ladder and climb up - which is significantly more dangerous. That's an obvious situation in which the existing rules are a fail.

It's a lot harder (but not impossible) to write a set of rules that are reasonable and allow for situations like this so instead of trying - they just declare entire areas to be complete NFZ's. Its lazy and overly restrictive. Some of the existing rules are good, necessary and required. Others - the result of laziness and pandering to fear-mongers and ignorant members of the general population who think the only reason to own a drone is to spy on their kids!


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[Neon Euc]

Sorry bro but that scene you speak of is faked.

Yep..... and another reason why the "drone police" on here pisses me off too. Saying we shouldn't do this or that and gives us "evidence" of something that isn't even real. Really don't understand some people sometimes *slaps head* [emoji55]

Neon Euc

 

[dirkclod]

Well that video and the how it was done has already been posted here awhile back I just didn't have time to find it.
That was all I was pointing out from his post .

 

[joet]

Yep..... and another reason why the "drone police" on here pisses me off too. Saying we shouldn't do this or that and gives us "evidence" of something that isn't even real. Really don't understand some people sometimes *slaps head* [emoji55]

Neon Euc

Yeah, well, those who completely ignore the rules or claim that the FAA's regulations are mere "suggestions" piss me off just as much.

The FAA has stated more than once that the current 107 rules were a starting point and that they would be refined over time, and that overflight of people was the first rule under consideration for relaxation. I would think that the cited example - and I will refine it here to "flight less than 100' over a structure in controlled airspace" - would be under consideration as well. However, now with the "add one/remove two" Executive Order in place, maybe that will be impacted? I'm not sure if revising a regulation counts.

My issue is -- and always has been -- that those who violate the rules blatantly may cause more restrictive regulations for us all. If highlighting the actual rules and calling out those who are ignoring them makes me the "drone police", so be it.

Oh, and can we please stop with the "but everyone exceeds the speed limit and it doesn't hurt anyone" type comparisons? Yes, if you go to 410', no one is going to die. If you lose sight of your aircraft briefly (and then work to establish sight right away), the same. It's the people who fly way beyond LOS - like miles away - who will be the ones who get attacked by a bird, or back into a wire, or whatever else transpires because they had no situational awareness of what was going on around the airplane that causes it to crash into a highway and get people killed - or whatever. And that's when not only the FAA but the States and municipalities start over-legislating. Do you want a State to decide that you cannot fly a drone in that State at all? Because when people start dying because of reckless flying, that's what will start happening. The rules - as much of a horrific burden to some that they are - are there to TRY to keep things as safe as possible.