Battery Care

[gagetman]

My name is Mike. And I'm happy to help. I've only owned my Phantom for about 3 months and knew nothing about them whatsoever until I joined this forum. I'm simply passing on information I've learned from other great members here.

Wow! You really have been taught well.You are the 3rd. Mike I've met here and all nice guys.Yes in general I've ONLY experienced lots of great help and friendliness until yesterday where I was told I couldn't see sarcasm even if it hit me in the face like a sack of coins.I think you know who this was?Anyway that's only one bad apple in the barrel. The rest of the guys here are all very well informed,patient and informative.Thanks to all of you.

 

[Melvoid]

So, if I just fly normally, down to 35% or so, can I just put the batteries away and not charge them again until right before I fly next time, however long that may be? Is that ok?

 

[msinger]

So, if I just fly normally, down to 35% or so, can I just put the batteries away and not charge them again until right before I fly next time, however long that may be? Is that ok?

You should do whatever you need to do in order to keep the batteries between this charge range when you're not using them:

 

[gagetman]

You should do whatever you need to do in order to keep the batteries between this charge range when you're not using them:

View attachment 105814

Hi Mike.But to check the batterie's charge you are always setting the timer back everytime when you push the button on.Must you always check the battery charge levels in the drone where the number of days always keeps imprinted on the battery? Where do you get that nice diagram?

 

[msinger]

But to check the batterie's charge you are always setting the timer back everytime when you push the button on

When not using your batteries for long periods of time, you don't need to check the charge level often. Once a month would be good enough.

Where do you get that nice diagram?

You can find it in the Phantom manual.

 

[gagetman]

When not using your batteries for long periods of time, you don't need to check the charge level often. Once a month would be good enough.


You can find it in the Phantom manual.

Hi Mike.This one dude that says he fixes drones has me now worried.He says after each batt.has had 20 flights you must "deep cycle" them.Hover drone low down till 4% then fully charge???He also says it's not good to leave the batteries for long periods.He says it's not good for them to sit loosing current then you have to charge them up again to 60%.He says you might not get a charge in them again and will have to throw them away! He says you must fly them at least once a month? I've got 5 batteries so I will have to fly every 6 days?

 

[3rdof5]

Hi Mike.This one dude that says he fixes drones has me now worried.He says after each batt.has had 20 flights you must "deep cycle" them.Hover drone low down till 4% then fully charge???He also says it's not good to leave the batteries for long periods.He says it's not good for them to sit loosing current then you have to charge them up again to 60%.He says you might not get a charge in them again and will have to throw them away! He says you must fly them at least once a month? I've got 5 batteries so I will have to fly every 6 days?

I've read its not necessary to "deep cycle" these types of batteries. Considering the battery life is about 200 charges, why waste one? But someone else might be able to explain why deep cycling might be a good thing. Also, as far as pressing the button to check the charge level goes, you only want to avoid doing that if you stored the battery with a charge level higher than 65%. For example, you store a fully charged battery that is set to autodischarge in 3 days. It will take 3 days for the autodischarge to start, then another 2 or 3 days for the battery to discharge down below 65%. So during those 6 days total you do NOT want to press the power button as that will interrupt the process. However after those 6 days the battery will be below 65% and will not autodischarge again until you recharge it so at that point there's no timer to reset and pressing the power button to check battery level is fine and does nothing but show you the battery level. You do not need to fly at periodically to keep the battery in good shape. As said above, as long as you periodically check the battery level and maintain its charge by partially charging as needed to keep it in the range of the graph, it will not be damaged from non use. If the battery is stored with too low of a charge and left alone too long, the level may drop so low that it will enter hibernation mode and may not come back out of it.

 

[msinger]

He says after each batt.has had 20 flights you must "deep cycle" them.Hover drone low down till 4% then fully charge?

You don't need to do this.

He says you might not get a charge in them again and will have to throw them away!

If the battery works as designed, it should not die if kept in the proper storage range.

I've got 5 batteries so I will have to fly every 6 days?

Just do what I recommended in this thread and all will be just fine.

 

[gagetman]

I've read its not necessary to "deep cycle" these types of batteries. Considering the battery life is about 200 charges, why waste one? But someone else might be able to explain why deep cycling might be a good thing. Also, as far as pressing the button to check the charge level goes, you only want to avoid doing that if you stored the battery with a charge level higher than 65%. For example, you store a fully charged battery that is set to autodischarge in 3 days. It will take 3 days for the autodischarge to start, then another 2 or 3 days for the battery to discharge down below 65%. So during those 6 days total you do NOT want to press the power button as that will interrupt the process. However after those 6 days the battery will be below 65% and will not autodischarge again until you recharge it so at that point there's no timer to reset and pressing the power button to check battery level is fine and does nothing but show you the battery level. You do not need to fly at periodically to keep the battery in good shape. As said above, as long as you periodically check the battery level and maintain its charge by partially charging as needed to keep it in the range of the graph, it will not be damaged from non use. If the battery is stored with too low of a charge and left alone too long, the level may drop so low that it will enter hibernation mode and may not come back out of it.

Thanks Mike. That sounds much better.Maybe we should put up a thread-Do you have to deep cycle your lipo battery or something to that effect? So if you ever have charged your battery to full it will always take say that 6 days discharge to reach the desired storeage state of 60%.Then why do they say never store a fully charged battery when it's not staying fully charged so as to damage it? So as this 100% charged batt.is taking 6 days to discharge do you now have to record this so that you know when it's safe to press the button and is there a easy way of keeping this record?? When partially charging a batt. up to its 60% will the timer kick in again?When you talk of the batteries having 200 charges you said why waste one?A charge?

 

[3rdof5]

Thanks Mike. That sounds much better.Maybe we should put up a thread-Do you have to deep cycle your lipo battery or something to that effect? So if you ever have charged your battery to full it will always take say that 6 days discharge to reach the desired storeage state of 60%.Then why do they say never store a fully charged battery when it's not staying fully charged so as to damage it? So as this 100% charged batt.is taking 6 days to discharge do you now have to record this so that you know when it's safe to press the button and is there a easy way of keeping this record?? When partially charging a batt. up to its 60% will the timer kick in again?When you talk of the batteries having 200 charges you said why waste one?A charge?

The auto discharge will only start if the battery is stored with a charge above 65%. And yes the battery life is approx 200 full charges. So you can say if you fully charge your battery before flying (which you always should do) you'll get 200 flights before the battery should be retired. Using one of the charge discharge cycles without flying is a waste of useful battery life. Don't worry too much about maintaining the battery. I don't always have very long flights but i always make sure I land with the battery level lower than 65% and higher than 30% That way the battery is ready to be stored safely without having to worry autodischarge kicking in. I simply leave it alone until I'm planning to fly and fully charge it before i fly. I try to fly at least once a week (weather permitting) so it's not like my batteries sit stored long enough to have to worry about their charge level. I dont mess with them. No need to deep cycle them. The only reason autodischarge even exists is in the event that someone fully charges before flight and then for some reason they cant fly. In that case the autodischarge will protect the battery from sitting too long fully charged. But otherwise, after flight just leave your battery alone, unless its very low then connect your charger and charge until the 3rd light starts to blink then disconnect.

 

[gagetman]

The auto discharge will only start if the battery is stored with a charge above 65%. And yes the battery life is approx 200 full charges. So you can say if you fully charge your battery before flying (which you always should do) you'll get 200 flights before the battery should be retired. Using one of the charge discharge cycles without flying is a waste of useful battery life. Don't worry too much about maintaining the battery. I don't always have very long flights but i always make sure I land with the battery level lower than 65% and higher than 30% That way the battery is ready to be stored safely without having to worry autodischarge kicking in. I simply leave it alone until I'm planning to fly and fully charge it before i fly. I try to fly at least once a week (weather permitting) so it's not like my batteries sit stored long enough to have to worry about their charge level. I dont mess with them. No need to deep cycle them. The only reason autodischarge even exists is in the event that someone fully charges before flight and then for some reason they cant fly. In that case the autodischarge will protect the battery from sitting too long fully charged. But otherwise, after flight just leave your battery alone, unless its very low then connect your charger and charge until the 3rd light starts to blink then disconnect.

So this hovering till 4% story is what you mean by being a waste of a full charge discharge cycle?So when the battery is below storage level and you charge it the coundown timer does not kick in? But when you've finished flying and you've left the battery below 65 and higher than 30% won't the battery eventually discharge quickly below 30% if you don't fly soon?So in other words you must monortor that battery before it gets to 30% and charge it back up to 60%?Going back to the 100% charged battery.I was told you can bring it down to 60% by putting it back into the drone and running it down that way.Or use the simulator while doing so?Will the auto discharger be cancelled out while doing this?

 

[3rdof5]

Yes hovering to 4% is just putting excess stress on the battery needlessly. Charging the battery to a safe storage level (below 65%) will not reactivate the discharge timer, the timer ONLY activates if the battery is above 65%. Also the batteries do not quickly discharge sitting stored. Any battery slowly loses it's charge over time but its nothing to be worried about. If you stored your battery with a 60% charge and left it alone for say 2 months, it "might" drop to maybe 50% but I doubt it would drop even that much. Depends on the temperature its stored at. As been said, checking on them once a month is prudent and wise but even at that you will likely not have to charge them. If you check the level and its 2 lights or less charge to the 3rd light starts to blink and disconnect (and no that will NOT reactivate autodischarge). Otherwise leave em alone

 

[solentlife]

Here's cut and paste from a Sheet offered to new owners in club :

So you have just bought your first DJI Phantom - with proper setup and care - you will be amazed at its video and photographic possibilities.
Lets go through various aspects of this new acquisition. Note this primarily applies to Phantom 3 batterys but other DJI packs will not be too dissimilar and most can be applied also.

Many people new to Hobby Battery systems wonder how to treat these battery's. They are used to charging computers / mobile phones but when it comes to hobby batterys such as LiPo - the rules change.
DJI battery's, while they are supposedly intelligent batteries, they fall short on various.

I hope the following can dispel some of the myths and misinformation that has grown up around the Phantom battery packs.

But first we have to consider opening the box and putting into service the whole system/

New Purchase:
You open the box and in eagerness want to get out and there and fly ! Please don't. Please resist that urge. There are a few items you need to do first.

a) Have latest DJI GO to register with DJI to activate the Aircraft (we shall call this AC).
b) Fully charged battery to ensure any updates / activation has sufficient battery power to complete.
c) Checked level floor for IMU calibration and identify a nice clean oustide area for Compass calibration. I suggest taking a hand held compass outside .. walk around and see where needle gets deflected - that is a spot you should stay away from. It could be pipes, cables, rebar etc. under the ground, overhead etc.

Follow the DJI tutorials for initial setup and calibrations. Youtube search will point you directly.

OK - you have setup your P3. I will not go into flight as that is something that you should practice and develop your own skill at. Just note that it is worth once reasonably happy with P-GPS mode - to swap to ATTI mode and fly manually to get used to a less stable AC. This skill will save you later when things start to get out of hand.

a) Never fly with a partial discharged battery.
b) I strongly suggest that the default 10 day discharge setting of GO be changed to 2 - 3 days for start of auto-discharge. This sets battery FW to user setting.
c) Do not deep discharge batterys every 20 flights or so - only do this rarely - as it accumulates damage to a LiPo. Even DJI themselves advise against it now. The claimed re-calibration is purely a mA in vs mA out counter in the battery control board. It can be useful to reset counter occasionally but it does not recover lost battery performance.
d) Try not to fly into the low battery warning zone. I leave my warnings at default - 30% low and 10% critical. I plan to land with about 30 - 35% battery level - which gives me a good storage level to bench my batterys.
e) Resist temptation to keep checking batterys - this resets auto discharge timer.
f) If you plan to not fly for significant period - then charge batterys fully. Place into storage and leave them alone. After a couple of weeks - check levels. If down to 2 led's - then charge again. Let auto discharge do its job. This way you will not enter hibernation mode and have any problems to use batterys months later.
g) A lot of talk about battery temperature - LiPo batterys are fine from 10C upwards. For some reason DJI decided to program the system so that we need to have a 'temperate warm' battery to fly. That is easily accomplished by placing battery inside your coat ... warmed in the car driving to site ... LiPo warming bags ... picnic bags with warmers in ... Many ways to accomplish this. It is a myth that you need to hover the AC if it is cold. If the AC powers up and takes off - that means battery is at working level and will fly. DJI AC do not fall out of sky for this !

Let us move on to after flight.

Batterys warm up when used. So it is good practice to allow the battery to cool before recharging.
Note that being a 4 cell pack and inside a case - the inner cells will take longer to cool down.
If you are not planning on flying for a while - then refer to point f) above. Some will advise charging partially etc. But the easiest and best way is via f). Charge up and let auto-discharge do its work. Note that the LED's are representative of 25% increments .. when flashing 12.5% - this means you are not that sure of what it really means when you see the LED's. BUt if you use the auto discharge system - you then know your batterys are being looked after. You just need to check every week or so. There are statements by some and also DJI that a figure of 50 - 60% charge level for storage is advised. This is actually not correct. LiPo manufacturers regardless of being standard 4.2C or High Voltage 4.35V per cell packs actually recc'd 30 - 50% with preference in the lower range. This is because it is a chemical action. But storage at 50% will not be significant problem if followed. Due to the often usual way these batterys are used - battery life can suffer more from various other factors such as leaving in a hot car, charging up too often, discharging too low etc.

DJI Battery Life : There are quotes around about the 200 cycle life of DJI batterys. My information is that 200 limit is no longer a shut off factor. But let us assume that battery reaches 200 charge cycles and does shut off. How do we get to 200 ? Not by each charge being a full cycle. In fact charge cycles are accumulative by adding partial cycles together. It is not a linear addition but suffice to say that the average owner will probably experience 400 - 500 or even more charges to accumulate 200 full cycle number.


Summary :
1) Always fly on a fully charged battery and I recc'd land when your battery level is around 30%.
2) Have auto discharge set to 2 - 3 days maximum and plug in every battery you have to AC to make sure Battery FW is updated to this setting.
2) Let your battery cool down before charging—somewhere around 30 minutes or until it is around room temperature.
3) If you fly and land to 30% - after about one week - charge your battery fully and let auto-discharge do its job to avoid battery entering Hibernation mode. Check each week or so for level and recharge if it falls below 2 LED's and let auto discharge work again.
4) Always top up charge before flight if battery stands for more than one day after charging. Switch on battery - then plug in charger to make sure top-up occurs.

I accept that this may disagree with some peoples views on the matter - but I base my suggestions on many years of LiPo use and a significant period of DJI ownership. My batterys perform ... and keep performing.

I wish all good flights and long battery life.

Nigel

Attached as PDF if anyone wants to print off ...