Class B Airspace

[Boog0822]

So I live about 6 miles from DFW International Airport near Dallas, TX. I'm outside the 5 mile no fly zone. I looked on several maps including the FAA app and it says I'm in Class B Airspace. I've read a bunch on it and still have no idea what flight limitations I would have here. I understand Class B Airspace is shaped kinda like an upside-down wedding cake with the bottom layer being the 5 mile drone no fly zone. Then the middle and top layers get gradually wider and higher up. I'm assuming I should be able to fly here but I can't find what restrictions there are for my area since all Class B areas are different. Anyone have any knowledge of this?

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[Theo450]

I assume you are flying recreationally. Class B airspace is no joke. You better be double total secret sure you have it right before you fly, regardless of what anyone else, including myself says.

That being said, have you viewed the sectional chart? Do you know how to read it? It will answer your questions. If I am under the floor of class B airspace, I call the tower to at least inform them of my presence. better have your ducks in a row when you call. Give them distance and direction from the tower and max altitude, your registration number, and date and times of your flight. Call at least 48 hours in advance. Don't be surprised if they say.... No.

If you are flying commercially, the rules are totally different.

 

[Boog0822]

Yes recreational flight. Have no idea what a sectional chart is or how to read it. I just wish they'd make it easy and tell me how high and how far I can fly. I can only go about 1500 feet out so I'm not near the 5 mile no fly area. Is there anywhere other than the chart that would explain it to a non-pilot?
Also, if you're under the floor why would you need to call the tower?

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[Theo450]

well boog, guess what, you are a pilot. The FAA considers your bird an aircraft, and in their airspace, you have to play by their rules. ATCs and airport managers are all about communication and safety. I have never had a bad conversation with them.

So, to make sure I don't feed you incorrect information, I am just going to suggest that you get on the FAA website n the sUAS area, and do some research about what you can and can't do. They want you to do good, and so they provide a lot of information and tools for you.

 

[Boog0822]

Cool thanks. I'll give it a try.

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[brolland]

You could always call the local FSDO (Flight Safety Directors Office) in your area. They are the local FAA and they can answer any and all questions.
North Texas FSDO-Contact the Office

North Texas FSDO
8700 Freeport Parkway
Suite 225
Irving, TX 75063
Phone: (214) 277-8500 Fax: (214) 277-8569 / 8570 / 8571





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[microraptor]

www.skyvector.com. this site will help you out. Little confusing at first, but it's a good place to start.

 

[Mark The Droner]

If you're a recreational pilot, you are flying under Part 101, so it would be a good idea to at least read it. It will clear up some of the confusion.

In addition, you will find the latter part of this thread interesting: Class B Airspace - Notifying Tower

 

[Boog0822]

I'm outside the 5 mile range and it still says Class B Area A on the AirMap App.

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[Boog0822]

www.skyvector.com. this site will help you out. Little confusing at first, but it's a good place to start.

Incomprehensible...

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[microraptor]

Look up a few YouTube videos on classes of airspace, it will give you a better understanding.

 

[Mark The Droner]

Marvelous.

From what I can tell from studying the below link, Class B Airspace's "inner radius" can extend laterally for up to a 10 mile radius from the center of an airport. And the "inner radius," starts at the surface and goes up.

So if that's true, that means it's possible that a drone hobbyist pilot could be nine miles from a major airport, and strictly following CFR Part 101, he would not be required to contact anybody. And yet the moment he launches, he's in Class B airspace, which is forbidden.

Class Bravo Airspace

And yet, the FAA has made almost no attempt to communicate this fact to hobbyists. In fact, CFR Part 101 makes no mention of it at all, other than a hobbyist must not endanger NAS.

If there's an error in this post, please advise.

 

[Boog0822]

I agree with your post. It's very contradictory.
Yet in all reality, if there's an airplane 9 miles from the airport, flying at 400 feet AGL, that plane has a lot more to worry about than hitting my drone...

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[FlyerFocus]

The KDFW Terminal Area Chart tells all you need to know and it is available on skyvector.com. If you look at it you'll see, in this case, the airspace is only a bit like an upside-down wedding cake. You'll see the inner section, which covers from the surface to 11,000 feet (110/SFC), extends in the direction of the runway localizers/centerlines. This is because the aircraft coming in and out of KDFW are not Cessna 172s. They are larger commercial aircraft, including heavies like 747-8s and A380s, that are flying published IFR approach and departure routes which afford a them larger area in which to maneuver. Five miles isn't enough space for these behemoth aircraft to maneuver so the Class B airspace isn't going to (and rarely does) coincide with a five-mile radius. Personally, if I were in Class G airspace underneath Class B airspace I would not be calling the tower. It's simply not their airspace. It's irrelevent--like telling your office-mate instead of your spouse what you'd like for dinner. It's not their deal. The tower only handles traffic that's close in (somewhere around five miles but again, it depends). The rest of the Class B airspace is being handled by a different approach/departure facility altogether. There are boxes on the TAC which say "CTC DALLAS-FT WORTH APP ON 135.975 OR 379.9" or other frequencies, depending on what piece of the airspace you're in. Those are the folks who handle the Class B airspace that's not immediately adjacent to the airfield. The airspace was designed such that they control the airspace that's necessary for them to separate their aircraft. These guys and gals are busy enough without me calling to let them know I am flying a drone nowhere near the airspace they are controlling.

 

[Mark The Droner]

Okay. But my point is we're not permitted to fly, according to the FAA. It doesn't matter if we call anybody or not. We may not fly.

See the bottom of this page: Airspace Restrictions

It says we may not fly.

So if that's true, how is it possible FAA or the Feds didn't breathe a word of this when they wrote up Part 101?

 

[FlyerFocus]

Okay. But my point is we're not permitted to fly, according to the FAA. It doesn't matter if we call anybody or not. We may not fly.

See the bottom of this page: Airspace Restrictions

It says we may not fly.

So if that's true, how is it possible FAA or the Feds didn't breathe a word of this when they wrote up Part 101?

If you're talking about this:

Recreational operators are required to give notice for flights within five miles of an airport to BOTH the airport operator and air traffic control tower, if the airport has a tower. However, recreational operations are not permitted in Class B airspace around most major airports without specific air traffic permission and coordination.

That's consistent with the rules for other aircraft. An airplane or any other type of aircraft may not enter Class B airspace without a clearance. If you call the tower and they say ok, that's a clearance.

 

[Mark The Droner]

Yes, I'm talking about that.

My point is that none of this is in CFR Part 101. That's alarming.

 

[Theo450]

So, this is why you need to know how to read the navigational charts. There is plenty of free FAA provided information about how to do this correctly. Just make the effort to get it mostly right, and you can keep yourself out of trouble. Generally speaking, if you are outside of a 5 mile radius of an airport, and are below 400 feet, you are in good shape. But don't take my word for it, the FAA is going to laugh at you if you say that I said it was cool.

 

[FlyerFocus]

So, this is why you need to know how to read the navigational charts. There is plenty of free FAA provided information about how to do this correctly. Just make the effort to get it mostly right, and you can keep yourself out of trouble. Generally speaking, if you are outside of a 5 mile radius of an airport, and are below 400 feet, you are in good shape. But don't take my word for it, the FAA is going to laugh at you if you say that I said it was cool.

I agree. The TACs and Sectionals are fun to read. Go and buy a paper one for $4-$5. It comes with a full panel that is a key to all the symbols and notations. Pour yourself a cup of coffee, or in my case a glass of wine, and soak up the chart for an hour or so. Extremely interesting and you'll get a huge amount of insight. Order one here: VFR Terminal Area Charts from FAA AeroNav NACO (NOS ) . There are other stores too.

 

[Mark The Droner]

After sleeping on it, I think I get it now.

Joe Shmoe lives in the middle of nowhere near nothing and gets a drone for Christmas. He does the right thing and learns all about recreational flying per Part 101. He flies from his back yard and takes it upon himself to follow FAA's 400' AGL guideline. No problems.

Jack Spratt lives nine miles from the middle of Atlanta International Airport and gets a drone for Christmas. He does the right thing and learns all about recreational flying per Part 101. He flies from his back yard within Class B airspace and takes it upon himself to follow FAA's 400' AGL guideline. No problems.

No problems - because in neither case is there an actual law being broken, and that includes the one about endangering NAS since, as Boog pointed out above, no manned AC is going to be flying under 400' AGL outside of five miles from an airport, regardless of the airspace classification.

So in summary, the truth it seems, is a recreational flier is not saddled with the responsibility of learning about Class B airspace or any other class, provided he carefully flies under all of the rules of Part 101 as he's required to do.

Anybody disagree?