Whoa Nelly! FAA Record Fine

SkyPan does have a FAA 333 exemption for a T rex 700 hell as of April of this year, that does not help them for all the other violations claimed against them. Regulations.gov
 
This is not the actual fine. This is what the FAA is asking for. I would not be shocked in the actual fine ends up being substantially less.
 
Right.

But it sends a 'message' and the legal costs to address this, Win - Lose - Settle, will be substantial as well.
 
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You really don't understand how the FAA or our government works, do you?
FAA civil penalties are but couch lint in a $90 billion DOT budget. Penalties don't even show in the FAA or DOT budget requests even though some airlines have been fined hundreds of millions for maintenance or hazardous materials violations. I really doubt that anyone in the enforcement division gets high-fives for their work let alone add to their performance reviews.

No, but I'm sure you will enlighten him with your wealth of knowledge.
 
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SkyPan does have a FAA 333 exemption for a T rex 700 hell as of April of this year, that does not help them for all the other violations claimed against them. Regulations.gov
There has to be more to the story. I sent an email to his attorney asking for the rules cited in the letter of violation. My bet is that it is 60 charges of §91.13. And nothing else.
 
There has to be more to the story. I sent an email to his attorney asking for the rules cited in the letter of violation. My bet is that it is 60 charges of §91.13. And nothing else.

I think it is exactly that. It's a fine for each illegal flight they made.
 
Right.

But it sends a 'message' and the legal costs to address this, Win - Lose - Settle, will be substantial as well.
The only 'message' it sends me is that you'd better be legal if you're going to shoot high profile/high dollar commercial work. I suspect their intent is to frighten every Tom **** and Harry shooting real estate and the like for hobby dollars. Maybe it will actually accomplish that. Who knows? If I were shooting low money/low profile stuff out in BFE I don't think this case would make me all that nervous but that's just me.
 
The only 'message' it sends me is that you'd better be legal if you're going to shoot high profile/high dollar commercial work. I suspect their intent is to frighten every Tom **** and Harry shooting real estate and the like for hobby dollars. Maybe it will actually accomplish that. Who knows? If I were shooting low money/low profile stuff out in BFE I don't think this case would make me all that nervous but that's just me.

You don't need to quote me to state your disregard or contempt for current regulations or guidelines.
 
Seems I've pushed someone's button. Oopsy.
 
Seems I've pushed someone's button. Oopsy.
the rock..nod.gif
 
Seems I've pushed someone's button. Oopsy.

Ok, ok. Stop with the button pushing. Don't let this turn into "that" thread. ;)
 
You really don't understand how the FAA or our government works, do you?
FAA civil penalties are but couch lint in a $90 billion DOT budget. Penalties don't even show in the FAA or DOT budget requests even though some airlines have been fined hundreds of millions for maintenance or hazardous materials violations. I really doubt that anyone in the enforcement division gets high-fives for their work let alone add to their performance reviews.

Steve!

First of all friend, I work for the Navy, and I know all to well how our governments money is shuffled around. You have to know the politics that go along with money right? I'm sure you do. At any rate sure 2 million bucks or so is a drop in the bucket.. but still a hefty sum.

But lets look at more facts [Moderator edit: removed] 2014 FY budget for the DOT was actually 76.6 billion (not 90) and of which the FAA was given 15.6 billion. I'll concede that 2 million is only 1/78th's of the FAA's budget however that's just 1 case. And what I meant by making your boss happy wasn't the individuals at the FAA getting atta-boy's at the office but a bigger picture than that.

[Moderator edit: content removed, name calling not tolerated.]
 
Last edited by a moderator:
From the FAA FY2015 Budget Estimates:
"The FY 2015 request of $9.75 billion represents an increase of 1.0 percent above the FY 2014 enacted
funding levels."
It is worth noting that this fine is for infractions that occurred between March 2012 and Nov 2014. But it is only in Oct 2015 that the investigation finished and fine came down. The wheels of federal beurocracy are slow and deliberate.

This company most likely has a lawyer set up legal structure, various liability policies, and other ways they've isolated themselves from putting their own personal assets at risk. It's not enough to just get LLC and do as you please. Something that people doing real estate flights for $50/pop usually forget.
Incorporation doesn't shield liability from illegal activity by individuals on behalf of the corporation. If he loses his case, what the corporation doesn't pay comes from his hide.

It's probably just coincidence, but the press release from the FAA occurred the very day that there was a Congressional hearing regarding UAS safety. I listened to the whole hearing (I have it recorded if anyone is interested) and the SkyPan International case was referenced three times as an example of the FAA enforcement actions for illegal UAS operations.
 
Steve!

First of all friend, I work for the Navy, and I know all to well how our governments money is shuffled around. You have to know the politics that go along with money right? I'm sure you do. At any rate sure 2 million bucks or so is a drop in the bucket.. but still a hefty sum.

Um, it's not "the Government's money".

From 'Public Papers of the Presidents of the United States- George W. Bush ': "Well, the Government spent this money; the Government spent that money. No, no; it's not the Government's money; it's the people's money."

Ironically, George was using this accurate description of whose money was being spent by the Government in order to encourage the reduction of Government spending and dramatically cut taxes on the rich. (Because it's mostly their money). Our Government spends our money as we, the people, direct through our Congresscritters. Flawed as this system is, it's light-years ahead of any other system of Government. If you don't like the way your money is being spent, send a new representative to Congress. I really don't know why we keep reelecting those who treat our money like a piggy-bank at the toy store.

Our system is not (yet) an oligarchy (a small group of people having control of a country), but the current trend of our politics is toward an oligarchy since it has become legal to buy politicians. (Citizens United). Until then, it's not the Government's money.

I rarely pull facts from thin air.
From:
DOT Budget Highlights Fiscal Year 2015
https://www.transportation.gov/sites/dot.gov/files/docs/BudgetHighlightsFY2015.pdf
Page 5:
"The President’s FY 2015 request for the Department of Transportation is $90.9 billion."
Page 34:
"The FY 2015 President’s Budget request of $15.4 billion supports FAA’s current programs in the areas of air traffic controller and safety staffing, research and development, and capital investment."
 
As I said before, there's more to this than originally reported. Remember back in 2014 when
three lawsuits were filed by attorney Brendan Schulman challenging the FAA's ban on model aircraft commercial flights.
The petition: u as America Petition

SkyPan International is one of those three plaintiff's.

The plot thickens.
 
I know that. Its just how he worded his first sentences.
Sorry, but that's my style.
But I am getting better - In prior lives I didn't let up on the sarcasm until the second or third paragraph.
 
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