Washington State Parks

[nathan morrison]

Ok, So I asked for the official policy. They responded:

Hello Nathan,

Thank you for contacting Washington State Parks regarding the use of UAV/Drones.


Each Washington State Park must have a policy in place and designate an area of use.

At this time, only Flaming Geyser State Park has a policy in place.


I posed your question to Robert Ingram, Chief of Law Enforcement.

Here is his official response:

Flying remote controlled aircraft in a non-designated area of the park is a violation of WAC 352-32-130(4)—an $87 non-traffic infraction http://apps.leg.wa.gov/wac/default.aspx?cite=352-32-130.



If they don't have a designated policy, How can I be in violation? Am I reading the policy right?

 

[GoodnNuff]

Ok, So I asked for the official policy. They responded:

Hello Nathan,

Thank you for contacting Washington State Parks regarding the use of UAV/Drones.


Each Washington State Park must have a policy in place and designate an area of use.

At this time, only Flaming Geyser State Park has a policy in place.


I posed your question to Robert Ingram, Chief of Law Enforcement.

Here is his official response:

Flying remote controlled aircraft in a non-designated area of the park is a violation of WAC 352-32-130(4)—an $87 non-traffic infraction http://apps.leg.wa.gov/wac/default.aspx?cite=352-32-130.



If they don't have a designated policy, How can I be in violation? Am I reading the policy right?

I believe they mean a policy allowing RC aircraft that specifies what type, size, gas vs electric, hours of operation, and the designated area of the park where they are allowed.
I'd love to fly over the river at Flaming Geyser, or along the cliff faces, but I'm limited to the boundaries of the designated field. To fly outside I would face a fine, risk my membership and jeopardize the entire club.

 

[tcope]

Here is his official response:

Flying remote controlled aircraft in a non-designated area of the park is a violation of WAC 352-32-130(4)—an $87 non-traffic infraction http://apps.leg.wa.gov/wac/default.aspx?cite=352-32-130.

My next question of them would be, have they complied with 4a-e as the rules require. Lacking their adherence to their own policy I'd say 4 does no apply. You could easily argue that without a designated flying area, the entire park is open to remote control flying.

 

[SteveMann]

I believe they mean a policy allowing RC aircraft that specifies what type, size, gas vs electric, hours of operation, and the designated area of the park where they are allowed.
I'd love to fly over the river at Flaming Geyser, or along the cliff faces, but I'm limited to the boundaries of the designated field. To fly outside I would face a fine, risk my membership and jeopardize the entire club.

Once you're airborne, you are in the FAA's jurisdiction. The park administration can only say where you can take off and land. Even their document says as much:
"(1) No aircraft shall land on or take off from any body of water or land area in a state park area not specifically designated for landing aircraft. "

 

[GoodnNuff]

Once you're airborne, you are in the FAA's jurisdiction. The park administration can only say where you can take off and land. Even their document says as much:
"(1) No aircraft shall land on or take off from any body of water or land area in a state park area not specifically designated for landing aircraft. "

Sorry Stevie, it is in the flying club's by laws, an agreement with the State Park system, the home owners on the other side of the river, and the flying club. Can only fly gas during certain hours and on certain days, electric 7 days a week from 10 AM to dusk, etc., etc. It is not the rangers or the FAA that will impose the nominal fine - it's our own club.
They respect the agreement that allows them to fly inside a state park. They aren't irresponsible enough to flaunt the "rules" because "they are really in the only the FAA's jurisdiction."

Are you implying we should fly in state parks and challenge the ranger's authority to stop us because they aren't FAA?

 

[Buzz313th]

Once you're airborne, you are in the FAA's jurisdiction. The park administration can only say where you can take off and land. Even their document says as much

Good try SteveMann..

Only problem is, "Your" not airborne, your "Drone" is airborne. Your still sitting there with the remote in your hand while the ranger is reading you your rights.

Ranger: Excuse me SIR, I am going to need to ask you to please retrieve your drone. You are not allowed to fly that here..

SteveMann: I'm sorry to differ with you Mr. Ranger, but I know my rights and nowhere does it say that I can't fly my "Drone" here. It only says I can't take off and land here.

Ranger: Ok, so how did your drone get up there (Points to drone flying around) if it didn't take off from this park? And where do you plan on landing your cherished drone in the next 15 minutes when your battery runs out?

SteveMann: (Blank Stare)

Ranger: (Looks at Mr. Mann and smiles) That is a pretty cool drone you got there. Mind if I watch you fly it for a bit?

Cut to...

15 minutes later with the smiling Ranger standing next to SteveMann.... the Phantom goes into RTH mode due to low battery and lands right next to Steve where it took off from.

Like I said, reading you your rights as you clutch your remote control..

 

[SteveMann]

Good try SteveMann..

Only problem is, "Your" not airborne, your "Drone" is airborne. Your still sitting there with the remote in your hand while the ranger is reading you your rights.

Ranger: Excuse me SIR, I am going to need to ask you to please retrieve your drone. You are not allowed to fly that here..

SteveMann: I'm sorry to differ with you Mr. Ranger, but I know my rights and nowhere does it say that I can't fly my "Drone" here. It only says I can't take off and land here.

Ranger: Ok, so how did your drone get up there (Points to drone flying around) if it didn't take off from this park? And where do you plan on landing your cherished drone in the next 15 minutes when your battery runs out?

SteveMann: (Blank Stare)

Ranger: (Looks at Mr. Mann and smiles) That is a pretty cool drone you got there. Mind if I watch you fly it for a bit?

Cut to...

15 minutes later with the smiling Ranger standing next to SteveMann.... the Phantom goes into RTH mode due to low battery and lands right next to Steve where it took off from.

Like I said, reading you your rights as you clutch your remote control..

That's not quite the dialogue I would use, but close. The park cannot regulate overflight. This is more pertinent to someone who would take off from forest service land which frequently abuts National Park land. If your drone had enough endurance, and some motorized gliders do, you could take off from a legal location, overfly the park then return for a legal landing, and the NPS can't say anything about it.
I hadn't thought of using RTH to incriminate myself regarding the takeoff location.

 

[SteveMann]

Sorry Stevie, it is in the flying club's by laws, an agreement with the State Park system, the home owners on the other side of the river, and the flying club. Can only fly gas during certain hours and on certain days, electric 7 days a week from 10 AM to dusk, etc., etc. It is not the rangers or the FAA that will impose the nominal fine - it's our own club.
They respect the agreement that allows them to fly inside a state park. They aren't irresponsible enough to flaunt the "rules" because "they are really in the only the FAA's jurisdiction."

Are you implying we should fly in state parks and challenge the ranger's authority to stop us because they aren't FAA?

The information that your flying club has a COA for the site is new. I thought the OP was asking about state parks in general.
I have never advocated provoking park authorities because they know little about aviation law. I simply point out that if challenged by Mr. Ranger, you should know your rights.

 

[Buzz313th]

That's not quite the dialogue I would use, but close. The park cannot regulate overflight. This is more pertinent to someone who would take off from forest service land which frequently abuts National Park land. If your drone had enough endurance, and some motorized gliders do, you could take off from a legal location, overfly the park then return for a legal landing, and the NPS can't say anything about it.
I hadn't thought of using RTH to incriminate myself regarding the takeoff location.

Hey Steve...

I was just having a good time with your post... Don't take it one way or the other..

 

[SteveMann]

Don't take it one way or the other..

Thanks, I never do.

 

[TiDrone]

Good afternoon. This appears to be a good place to ask my question (although I can start a new thread if necessary).

I am a beginner drone pilot (hobbyist) and have a trip scheduled out to Washington state next month, near Carson.
I was hoping to get some footage of the Columbia River Gorge and possibly some waterfalls - just generally some good scenic shots.

I'm still learning. There are FAA regulations, the national park service, state laws that may differ from state to state and potentially even local laws at the municipal level.

I'm trying to understand whether this is feasible, legal, etc. Right now the most I've been able to establish is that there is legislation pending in the state senate. Drones are clearly prohibited in national parks; however the area I was looking at was in and around national forest, not a park.

And then there are state parks subject to rules as mentioned above.

Can anyone offer clarification?

Thanks!

 

[Sagebrush]

I don't think there are any rules about flying drones from National Forests. (I'm surrounded.) The exception is for commercial activity and there's a permitting process that is cumbersome. And forget about areas designated as wilderness.

They may have rules concerning drones flying from administrative sites–campgrounds and such.

Unmanned Aircraft Systems | US Forest Service

S

 

[GoodnNuff]

Good afternoon. This appears to be a good place to ask my question (although I can start a new thread if necessary).

I am a beginner drone pilot (hobbyist) and have a trip scheduled out to Washington state next month, near Carson.
I was hoping to get some footage of the Columbia River Gorge and possibly some waterfalls - just generally some good scenic shots.

I'm still learning. There are FAA regulations, the national park service, state laws that may differ from state to Y state and potentially even local laws at the municipal level.

I'm trying to understand whether this is feasible, legal, etc. Right now the most I've been able to establish is that there is legislation pending in the state senate. Drones are clearly prohibited in national parks; however the area I was looking at was in and around national forest, not a park.

And then there are state parks subject to rules as mentioned above.

Can anyone offer clarification?

Thanks!

I fly in our state's National Forests quite often. There is no restriction on flying within the National Forest. You will have some great places to fly near Carson with beautiful vistas of the Gorge. Enjoy your time!

 

[sdtrojan]

Thanks for the link, sagebrush, very useful

 

[Snowpilot]

Ok, So I asked for the official policy. They responded:

Hello Nathan,

Thank you for contacting Washington State Parks regarding the use of UAV/Drones.


Each Washington State Park must have a policy in place and designate an area of use.

At this time, only Flaming Geyser State Park has a policy in place.


I posed your question to Robert Ingram, Chief of Law Enforcement.

Here is his official response:

Flying remote controlled aircraft in a non-designated area of the park is a violation of WAC 352-32-130(4)—an $87 non-traffic infraction WAC 352-32-130: Aircraft..



If they don't have a designated policy, How can I be in violation? Am I reading the policy right?

I was wondering it anyone has any update about this? Is it legal to fly within Washington State Parks that do NOT have a policy in place?

 

[Phantom of the Gorge]

Here are the official rules; WAC 352-32-130: Aircraft.

To me it seems there is a conflict in the wording.

Near the beginning it implies that all areas of state parks are no fly zones except "only within flying areas designated by the director or designee".

It also states "The director or designee shall ensure that any remote controlled aircraft flying restrictions contained in the remote controlled aircraft flying management plan are conspicuously posted at the entrance of the affected park area.",

At the end of the code it states, "(6) Any violation of this section, including any failure to abide by a conspicuously posted remote controlled aircraft flying restriction or failure to abide by the terms of written permission to fly remote controlled aircraft, is an infraction under chapter 7.84 RCW.

That last part seems to say you are okay as long as you are not flying in a posted area while the first part seems to indicate you may need to seek out "designated areas", they could get you because of the RED type above .

Assuming I don't see an area posted, I will fly but make sure I carry a copy of the code. I will also be polite and comply with any law enforcement requests, if they attempt to ticket me I will produce the code and explain my interpretation. If I find an area posted I guess I'll try to get an exception before swimming upstream.

 

[Colorado68]

Once you're airborne, you are in the FAA's jurisdiction. The park administration can only say where you can take off and land. Even their document says as much:
"(1) No aircraft shall land on or take off from any body of water or land area in a state park area not specifically designated for landing aircraft. "

Much like the rules I

Once you're airborne, you are in the FAA's jurisdiction. The park administration can only say where you can take off and land. Even their document says as much:
"(1) No aircraft shall land on or take off from any body of water or land area in a state park area not specifically designated for landing aircraft. "

Trey Goudy couldn't have said it better. I'm with you Steve on your comment. Thank you for stating the basiscs.
if you're local jurisdiction prohobits launching and landing drones from their property, thats fine and respect the rule. Launching from public property and flying over theirs is lawful regulated by the FAA. Once the libs accept the loss to Trump they will get the gist of it. TRUMP
Makes common senss. The rest who dont beleive are racists.

 

[Colorado68]

Written