Phantom 2 Vision WIFI mods

Re: Phantom 2 Vision WIFI

well my antennas arrived today.

1.- look and feel very excelent quality.
2.- it consisting of the Blackhawk lightweight ( 12 dB) and the new skew planar ( CP ) for 2.4 GHz, both LHCP
3.- i have not taste then but i will in the afternoon and i let you now the range.
4.- im not sure where tu put the CP, on the pv2, to do not loose signal but taste and error i think.
5.- i just plug the cp on one of the camara antennas the other its stock.





 
Re: Phantom 2 Vision WIFI

Looks good let us know how it does
I will be getting my antennas tomorrow and will post an update then
Looks like your going to have to upgrade the 5.8 now
 
Re: Phantom 2 Vision WIFI

Have any of you tried the little 11 dbi panel on the repeater and seen what that can do?
 
Re: Phantom 2 Vision WIFI

After trying a wide range of linear antennas on the pv in various positions and angles. I now conclude that linear antennas on the pv offer no advantage over the stock lhcp antennas. This is surprising given the 3dbi mismatch between cp and linear. I have orderd a set of lhcp helical and skew planar and will continue hunting range. The best that I have achieved so far with the docooler repeater and netgear linear patch antenna, with stock camera antennas is 1.6 KM. I am hopeful that lhcp is the way forward. Will post results once the parts arrive.
 
Re: Micro amps

varmint said:
Has anyone looked into solutions that allow for internal installation, such as the micro amplifiers sold here: http://rf-links.com/newsite/amplifiers/5800.html

Some of these guys are super small and I would think could easily be installed inside the repeater and/or transmitter. The small ones draw about 500 mA and could easy be powered from an alkaline pack. I would think the gain in reception for 2.4Ghz and transmission for 5Ghz would be far better than an antenna upgrade (at least a portable one).


I went with this one on camera:
http://www.radiolabs.com/products/wirel ... -800mw.php

Used a UBEC to power it. I went ahead and took off the big heavy right angle adapter and soldered the cable directly to the board. Everything appears to work. All the lights come on including the red tx light when the wifi is turned to on on the camera so i think it is working ok.

The problem is that it is not too obvious if it is helping with my range. I am still lucky to get 1000feet with an 8dbi tplink omni on repeater and a little 2dbi antenna on the amp. I thought increasing the output power of the camera tx from 100mw to 800mw would make an obvious difference.

I need to be more scientific to see if it is helping. I tried the range in my apartment through walls and doors without and without the amp turned on. There wasn't much difference. Walked down the hallway until the signal cut and got about the same distance down the hallway.

is there is way to measure the rf signal without spending any more money The little bar indicator on the DJI app is too qualitative. Seems like there should be an app to measure wifi signal strength more quantitatively. I would need to connect directly two the P2V rather than to the repeater i presume. Unfortunately, i don't have a rf meter like Immersion RC makes.

Interestingly, i am not using an attenuator on the amp and so far not getting too warm. It does warm up slightly when i am downloading a vid from the sd card but in flight it stays remarkably cool. The propwash seems to help a lot.

Unless my amp is damaged or if i screwed something up when i soldered the cable on i would say the improvement is a bit disappointing. I am going to try it with the 5dbi antenna on the amp and see if that helps.

In general I would say my range has been poor compared to what you guys are all claiming. With the stock setup i was lucky to get 600feet range.

I am tempted to try the 2.4ghz LHCP pinwheels that FPVLR sells but not sure i want to spend $60 more dollars to find out it doesn't help much.
 
Re: Micro amps

helixaviator said:
I went with this one on camera:
http://www.radiolabs.com/products/wirel ... -800mw.php
This is the amp I use. It is a good amp, 800mw for 11b, 500mw for 11g, mine is testing out at 350mw.
Used a UBEC to power it. Which UBEC? not all are created equal and exactly what voltage?.I went ahead and took off the big heavy right angle adapter and soldered the cable directly to the board. Everything appears to work. All the lights come on including the red tx light when the wifi is turned to on on the camera so i think it is working ok. Blinking lights mean very little to me. Did you test it before making the (rather significant) modifications? How did you test your mods? Did you at least attach a heatsink to the PCB GP? I've not changed mine out because I figured there could be a reason they precision CNC a solid piece of aluminium rather than use injection mold plastic. But I could be wrong.

The problem is that it is not too obvious if it is helping with my range. I am still lucky to get 1000feet with an 8dbi tplink omni on repeater and a little 2dbi antenna on the amp. I thought increasing the output power of the camera tx from 100mw to 800mw would make an obvious difference. Without getting too deep into it, antennas will make much more difference than power. When factoring in power you need to consider a LOT more than rated mw. To begin with, my camera varies between 100 and 125mw and the amp 300 to 375mw. To double the theoretic (potential) range you would need to quadruple the power (400 to 500mw), even then, in real world testing (considering other factors like noise, ...) you are likely to only see a 75% improvement. You also changed the antenna from a custom (with likely VERY good SWR) to a 2dbi nub (likely useless) essentially defeating any potential gains.

I need to be more scientific to see if it is helping. I tried the range in my apartment through walls and doors without and without the amp turned on. There wasn't much difference. Walked down the hallway until the signal cut and got about the same distance down the hallway.

is there is way to measure the rf signal without spending any more money Not that I'm aware of.The little bar indicator on the DJI app is too qualitative. Seems like there should be an app to measure wifi signal strength more quantitatively. There are apps for some laptop adapters, just not sure how to test the P2V with them.I would need to connect directly two the P2V rather than to the repeater i presume. Unfortunately, i don't have a rf meter like Immersion RC makes.

Interestingly, i am not using an attenuator The radio labs site clearly states in big red letters that the max input is 20dbm (100mw) or the amp will be damaged. The camera is putting out in excess of 100mw. Even if the amp is not damaged, it's clipping. it's like talking into your phone with a megaphone, the noise level will go through the roof.on the amp and so far not getting too warm. It does warm up slightly when i am downloading a vid from the sd card but in flight it stays remarkably cool.What type of thermocouple are you using to track the amp's temperature? The propwash seems to help a lot.

Unless my amp is damaged or if i screwed something up when i soldered the cable on i would say the improvement is a bit disappointing. I am going to try it with the 5dbi antenna on the amp and see if that helps. I agree with usign a better antenna. I can share my own experience. As I've said in the past, the antennas make all the difference. Using antennas alone, on the stock amps I did 3.2km, adding the amp got me to 3.89km (might have gone further but control dropped) that said, I doubt very much that the amp would have gotten me over 5km (would not have doubled my range).

In general I would say my range has been poor compared to what you guys are all claiming. With the stock setup i was lucky to get 600feet range. Amplifying the stock setup would only net you probably 400 feet (for a total of 1000 feet). You need to work on your antennas first. My stock setup worked to 1500ft and if I flew sideways I could (depending on conditions) get to 1800 to a max of 2200 feet. Simply changing antennas got me to 10,000 feet (3.2km) (under good conditions) and over 5,000 feet even in my neighborhood (challenging conditions). Adding the amp increases my neighborhood range to about 8,000 feet (from 5,000).

I am tempted to try the 2.4ghz LHCP pinwheels that FPVLR sells but not sure i want to spend $60 more dollars to find out it doesn't help much. A good (matched) antenna configuration on each side will net improved results. Of course how much improvement is a YMMV thing.
 
Re: Phantom 2 Vision WIFI

Thanks for the info Themosttoys. I am using this UBEC:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Hobbywing-3A-UB ... 2336211b86

It is at the 5v setting. The ac power supply that came with it is also 5v even though it says on their site that the input voltage is 6v for this amp.

As for the rf input the rf engineer at radiolabs seemed to think it would probably be fine if camera is outputting 100mw give or take assuming their is some cable losses etc. But makes sense if the noise is getting amplified. Don't really understand how these things work; if they filter out the noise or what.

I haven't used my temperature probe on it but it barely gets warm to the touch with the supplied heat sink.

Well its been a fun experiment. Was hoping it would be a one and done thing and wouldn't require too much fiddling. Not looking to go that far just would like stable video up to 1km or so. Guess I should have spent more time on antennas first like you said.

I don't know how good of an amp it is or if radiolabs designed these things or not. I wouldn't be surprised if its this amp with a custom cnc case to be honest:

http://zhyichina.en.alibaba.com/product ... eater.html
 
Re: Phantom 2 Vision WIFI

helixaviator said:
Thanks for the info Themosttoys. I am using this UBEC:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Hobbywing-3A-UB ... 2336211b86

It is at the 5v setting. The ac power supply that came with it is also 5v even though it says on their site that the input voltage is 6v for this amp.

As for the rf input the rf engineer at radiolabs seemed to think it would probably be fine if camera is outputting 100mw give or take assuming their is some cable losses etc. But makes sense if the noise is getting amplified. Don't really understand how these things work; if they filter out the noise or what.

I haven't used my temperature probe on it but it barely gets warm to the touch with the supplied heat sink.

Well its been a fun experiment. Was hoping it would be a one and done thing and wouldn't require too much fiddling. Not looking to go that far just would like stable video up to 1km or so. Guess I should have spent more time on antennas first like you said.

I don't know how good of an amp it is or if radiolabs designed these things or not. I wouldn't be surprised if its this amp with a custom cnc case to be honest:

http://zhyichina.en.alibaba.com/product ... eater.html

That is a good BEC, not that it will make any difference, but it should not hurt to switch to the 6V position.

I know the heatsink does not get warm to the touch, but I don't know how much heat it is pulling away from the amp. Might not make any difference but it is curious to me why they machined the inside of the aluminium case they way they did (so that the case presses against the GP.) On the alibaba one, there are vent slits (can't tell what's behind them).

Either way, if all you want is 1km, I'd ditch the amp and go for a good set of circular polarized antennas (one for the P2V and one for the repeater). With good antennas, proper placement / orientation and line of sight (no obstructions) I can pretty much guarantee over 1km.

Cheers
 
Re: Phantom 2 Vision WIFI

themosttoys said:
helixaviator said:
Thanks for the info Themosttoys. I am using this UBEC:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Hobbywing-3A-UB ... 2336211b86

It is at the 5v setting. The ac power supply that came with it is also 5v even though it says on their site that the input voltage is 6v for this amp.

As for the rf input the rf engineer at radiolabs seemed to think it would probably be fine if camera is outputting 100mw give or take assuming their is some cable losses etc. But makes sense if the noise is getting amplified. Don't really understand how these things work; if they filter out the noise or what.

I haven't used my temperature probe on it but it barely gets warm to the touch with the supplied heat sink.

Well its been a fun experiment. Was hoping it would be a one and done thing and wouldn't require too much fiddling. Not looking to go that far just would like stable video up to 1km or so. Guess I should have spent more time on antennas first like you said.

I don't know how good of an amp it is or if radiolabs designed these things or not. I wouldn't be surprised if its this amp with a custom cnc case to be honest:

http://zhyichina.en.alibaba.com/product ... eater.html

That is a good BEC, not that it will make any difference, but it should not hurt to switch to the 6V position.

I know the heatsink does not get warm to the touch, but I don't know how much heat it is pulling away from the amp. Might not make any difference but it is curious to me why they machined the inside of the aluminium case they way they did (so that the case presses against the GP.) On the alibaba one, there are vent slits (can't tell what's behind them).

Either way, if all you want is 1km, I'd ditch the amp and go for a good set of circular polarized antennas (one for the P2V and one for the repeater). With good antennas, proper placement / orientation and line of sight (no obstructions) I can pretty much guarantee over 1km.

Cheers

Sorry to get between your conversation, guys, but why exactly do you need a UBEC and how do you mount/assemble it?
 
Re: Phantom 2 Vision WIFI

cavaleiro01 said:
Sorry to get between your conversation, guys, but why exactly do you need a UBEC and how do you mount/assemble it?

The amplifier needs power in the form of 5v to 6.5v. Two options are 1) to fly a battery (typically a 7.4v, which is actually 8.5 when fully charged). 2) pull power from the P2V battery (11.1v but over 12.5 when fully charged.) The BEC steps the voltage down to the range that is usable by the amplifier.
 
Re: Micro amps

helixaviator said:
is there is way to measure the rf signal without spending any more money The little bar indicator on the DJI app is too qualitative. Seems like there should be an app to measure wifi signal strength more quantitatively. I would need to connect directly two the P2V rather than to the repeater i presume. Unfortunately, i don't have a rf meter like Immersion RC makes.
If you have Android device, you may download a free app called Wifi Analyzer https://play.google.com/store/apps/deta ... yzer&hl=en (or other similar apps). On my Nexus 7, Wifi Analyzer can show hidden SSID signal strength (Vision camera FC200_XXXXXX is a hidden SSID). You may then compare Wifi signal strength with and without an amplifier at the same distance. This is not accurate measurement, but just a brief idea of how much extra gain with amplifier.
 
Re: Phantom 2 Vision WIFI

themosttoys said:
cavaleiro01 said:
Sorry to get between your conversation, guys, but why exactly do you need a UBEC and how do you mount/assemble it?

The amplifier needs power in the form of 5v to 6.5v. Two options are 1) to fly a battery (typically a 7.4v, which is actually 8.5 when fully charged). 2) pull power from the P2V battery (11.1v but over 12.5 when fully charged.) The BEC steps the voltage down to the range that is usable by the amplifier.

Got it, Themosttoys, thanks!
 
Re: Phantom 2 Vision WIFI

Here's my setup. I've been reading and watching several threads in the forum for a while and finally decided on the below setup.

Vision Antenna Mods
Qty 2 http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B008AGUTPC/ref=oh_details_o04_s00_i00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
Qty 2 http://www.readymaderc.com/store/in...id=813&zenid=7384585c0972055a79df615075443786
IMG_0416.JPG

IMG_0417.JPG
 
Re: Phantom 2 Vision WIFI

COtto1984 said:
Here's my setup. I've been reading and watching several threads in the forum for a while and finally decided on the below setup.

Looks good, let us know how it performs. Just fyi, a best case scenario for those antennas (in a pair like that) would be to separate them by at least 5 (4.92) inches (of course it will still work, just not optimal). BTW, what's on the repeater?

Happy flying.
 
Re: Phantom 2 Vision WIFI

themosttoys I have really enjoyed reading about all the test you have performed...im looking to be able to fly
1.5 miles id be happy with one mile what would be the optimal setup and where can I buy the parts that
it would require. thanks a lot for you input.
 
Re: Phantom 2 Vision WIFI

themosttoys said:
COtto1984 said:
Here's my setup. I've been reading and watching several threads in the forum for a while and finally decided on the below setup.

Looks good, let us know how it performs. Just fyi, a best case scenario for those antennas (in a pair like that) would be to separate them by at least 5 (4.92) inches (of course it will still work, just not optimal). BTW, what's on the repeater?

Happy flying.
They have performed excellent so far! I can easily hit 3300 ft when paired with the below setup. I didn't go any further for two reasons. I was starting to lose control and the app goes to N/A when you hit 3300 ft.

Even though they are closer than 5 inches, does it really matter on a diversity setup? Just curious. That is good information to know though.

Standalone Repeater Setup
Qty 1 http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B005KP473Q/ref=oh_details_o01_s00_i01?ie=UTF8&psc=1
Qty 1 http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00F5V6W1A/ref=oh_details_o02_s00_i00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
Qty 1 http://www.foxtechfpv.com/monitor-battery-p-597.html
Qty 2 http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B005DCP280/ref=oh_details_o06_s00_i00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
Qty 1 http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00FAJF7XQ/ref=oh_details_o03_s00_i00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
Qty 1 http://www.readymaderc.com/store/in...d=1252&zenid=7384585c0972055a79df615075443786
IMG_0418.JPG

IMG_0419.JPG

IMG_0420.JPG
 
Re: Phantom 2 Vision WIFI

Wow, COtto1984,

Even if that phantom and ground antenna setup doesn't work any better than out of the box, it looks bad-***!

I would imagine most passerby would be afraid for their privacy and personal safety when you launched that rig.

Nice! (jealous)

:mrgreen:
 
Re: Phantom 2 Vision WIFI

COtto1984 said:
They have performed excellent so far! I can easily hit 3300 ft when paired with the below setup. I didn't go any further for two reasons. I was starting to lose control and the app goes to N/A when you hit 3300 ft.

Even though they are closer than 5 inches, does it really matter on a diversity setup? Just curious. That is good information to know though.

Great antenna match.

Yup, it still matters in diversity configurations. Next question is probably "then why do they put the antennas so close together on the docooler I'm using?" The part of a linear antenna (like the antennas that come with the docooler) that matters is the 1.5 inches at the top end of each whip antenna. Not getting into all the details, the basics are that for typical wifi MIMO setups there is an advantage to splitting the antennas on the repeater at different angles (essentially resulting in the 5 inch separation.) Again, it will still work, just not optimal (and probably will not matter to you, unless you are going for a record.)

BTW, since there are now more people on this forum that know what terms like "correlation coefficient" mean and how diversity systems work, I'll also add that it is of course possible to have antennas optimized and closer than 4.92 inches (wavelength), it just takes much more careful consideration and placement. Basically it's not what most would consider simple.

Cheers
 
Re: Micro amps

PVFlyer said:
helixaviator said:
is there is way to measure the rf signal without spending any more money The little bar indicator on the DJI app is too qualitative. Seems like there should be an app to measure wifi signal strength more quantitatively. I would need to connect directly two the P2V rather than to the repeater i presume. Unfortunately, i don't have a rf meter like Immersion RC makes.
If you have Android device, you may download a free app called Wifi Analyzer https://play.google.com/store/apps/deta ... yzer&hl=en (or other similar apps). On my Nexus 7, Wifi Analyzer can show hidden SSID signal strength (Vision camera FC200_XXXXXX is a hidden SSID). You may then compare Wifi signal strength with and without an amplifier at the same distance. This is not accurate measurement, but just a brief idea of how much extra gain with amplifier.


Do you know hot to find the SSID since it is hidden?
 
Re: Micro amps

helixaviator said:
PVFlyer said:
helixaviator said:
is there is way to measure the rf signal without spending any more money The little bar indicator on the DJI app is too qualitative. Seems like there should be an app to measure wifi signal strength more quantitatively. I would need to connect directly two the P2V rather than to the repeater i presume. Unfortunately, i don't have a rf meter like Immersion RC makes.
If you have Android device, you may download a free app called Wifi Analyzer https://play.google.com/store/apps/deta ... yzer&hl=en (or other similar apps). On my Nexus 7, Wifi Analyzer can show hidden SSID signal strength (Vision camera FC200_XXXXXX is a hidden SSID). You may then compare Wifi signal strength with and without an amplifier at the same distance. This is not accurate measurement, but just a brief idea of how much extra gain with amplifier.


Do you know hot to find the SSID since it is hidden?

The hidden SSID of your Vision camera is shown in Vision app Settings | Binding.

For measuring signal strength, you don't need to know the SSID. If you open the Wifi Analyzer app and flip to a page below as highlighted in red, you may see a "?" following the MAC address. That's the Vision camera signal strength, -37 dBm in that particular instance. If you move your device away from the camera, you may see lower signal strength, or vice versa.

BTW, Phantom _XXXXXX is the repeater signal strength.
 

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