Phantom 2 flyways

JepePepe · Mar 2, 2014

There are several good example videos out there where the Phantom just decides to start climbing the stratossphere

I cant see how that would be a pilot error.

Phantom is a mass produced and agressively priced unit. And it could be as simple as being bad QC at the factory. But I think that is higly irresponsible considering it is an airial vehicle capable of climbing way up above clouds and able to gain a lot of momentum when out of control.

I dont want to read in the paper when one of these smashes into a turbine of an airliner. This could happend even if you didnt fly it in the proximity of airfield. As it has 20 min flight time it can travel quite a distance full speed in that time.

People who fly UAVs are usually taking safety very seriously (at least they used to) so I belive that should also be a major factor for the manufacturers too. Not to hide bedind just blaming pilot error. (which ofcourse causes some crashes especially now when the hobby speads like bushfire)

freyjoel · Mar 2, 2014

JepePepe said:
There are several good example videos out there where the Phantom just decides to start climbing the stratossphere I cant see how that would be a pilot error.

Phantom is a mass produced and agressively priced unit. And it could be as simple as being bad QC at the factory. But I think that is higly irresponsible considering it is an airial vehicle capable of climbing way up above clouds and able to gain a lot of momentum when out of control.

I dont want to read in the paper when one of these smashes into a turbine of an airliner. This could happend even if you didnt fly it in the proximity of airfield. As it has 20 min flight time it can travel quite a distance full speed in that time.

People who fly UAVs are usually taking safety very seriously (at least they used to) so I belive that should also be a major factor for the manufacturers too. Not to hide bedind just blaming pilot error. (which ofcourse causes some crashes especially now when the hobby speads like bushfire)

I must suck at searching youtube because I'm not finding this massive amount of P2 non-vision flyaways that clearly show the operator did nothing wrong. Could please link a few examples (in particular those with iosd data showing would be most helpful)?

JepePepe · Mar 2, 2014

QuadZilla said:
JepePepe said:

So how come can every other RC copter can handle phones and wifis without getting bezerk

Click to expand...

What makes you assume that flyaways are only caused by "phones and wifis"?

How did you determine that every other RC helicopter can handle "phones and wifis" and what flight controller are all of those other RC helicopters using?

Show me one that cant. I can only find Phantom videos... and as I said IT IS DJI THAT CLAIMS "it is phones and wifis or pilot error" NOT ME

I claim it is faulty units. Whether i is one faulty engine which is being found out on a lot of units, software bug, TX, RX of FC. Something is wrong wiht those bad boys.

Youtube is full of phantom "fly away" videos. Where usually one of the two things happens:

1.It either banks hard and goes grazy + totally stops responding and only occasionally reacts to any RC commands.
- then it speeds up like madman and eventually crashes at high speed.
The pattern is always similar.

2.It boosts up up up up motors revving and keeps going until power out.

thongbong · Mar 2, 2014

JepePepe said:
Youtube is full of phantom "fly away" videos. Where usually one of the two things happens:

1.It either banks hard and goes grazy + totally stops responding and only occasionally reacts to any RC commands.
- then it speeds up like madman and eventually crashes at high speed.
The pattern is always similar.

2.It boosts up up up up motors revving and keeps going until power out.

What version Phantom are you looking at in YouTube? Most of the flyaway vids are phantom 1 - original. Another cause is also a loose GPS unit. If your GPS came loose in a crash it will fly like a flyaway. True story. Been there done that crashed many.

freyjoel · Mar 2, 2014

JepePepe, Simple request. Please link Phantom P2 Non-Vision flyaways. I'm having difficulty finding clear cut examples that rule our operator error. You seem to have no trouble finding them. Or are you referring to P1 and P2 Vision flyaways?

I think there were clearly issues with P1's and P2 Visions. But you came here claiming 30-40% of all P2 Non-Visions are flying away. Please back up your claim.

bernardb · Mar 2, 2014

Yikes....I am so very lucky to have one of the few perfect Phantom 2's
It flies perfectly according to the specifications.
It behaves precisely as expected in each control mode.
It is the best and most sophisticated flying machine I have ever owned.
I treat it like a prized possession and am extremely careful to follow all procedures before lifting from the ground.
I ensure I am in the correct control mode, ensure the safety of my surroundings, and have a very clear plan in mind for my flight.
I go over in my mind what I am trying to accomplish, what I want to video, how I want to approach my target, etc.
It is rehearsed in my mind before the actual flight.
Perhaps I am too **** about this but I take it very seriously.

I believe random un commanded flyaways are very rare...
I believe most are pilot error....
Just my take on it...I am very happy to own this little gem!

thongbong · Mar 2, 2014

bernardb said:
Yikes....I am so very lucky to have one of the few perfect Phantom 2's
It flies perfectly according to the specifications.
It behaves precisely as expected in each control mode.
It is the best and most sophisticated flying machine I have ever owned.
I treat it like a prized possession and am extremely careful to follow all procedures before lifting from the ground.
I ensure I am in the correct control mode, ensure the safety of my surroundings, and have a very clear plan in mind for my flight.
I go over in my mind what I am trying to accomplish, what I want to video, how I want to approach my target, etc.
It is rehearsed in my mind before the actual flight.
Perhaps I am too **** about this but I take it very seriously.

I believe random un commanded flyaways are very rare...
I believe most are pilot error....
Just my take on it...I am very happy to own this little gem!

Oh my friend, you have angered the flyaway gods

freyjoel · Mar 2, 2014

bernardb said:
Yikes....I am so very lucky to have one of the few perfect Phantom 2's
It flies perfectly according to the specifications.
It behaves precisely as expected in each control mode.
It is the best and most sophisticated flying machine I have ever owned.
I treat it like a prized possession and am extremely careful to follow all procedures before lifting from the ground.
I ensure I am in the correct control mode, ensure the safety of my surroundings, and have a very clear plan in mind for my flight.
I go over in my mind what I am trying to accomplish, what I want to video, how I want to approach my target, etc.
It is rehearsed in my mind before the actual flight.
Perhaps I am too **** about this but I take it very seriously.

I believe random un commanded flyaways are very rare...
I believe most are pilot error....
Just my take on it...I am very happy to own this little gem!

Yeah...strange isn't it. Seems like the people in these boards with significant RC experience or who are **** about their P2's (thoroughly understand the manual, watched countless youtube instructional videos before and after purchase, follow checklists, pay close attention to the start up light sequence, have FPV systems with iosd, etc) not seem to have this massive flyaway "problem". What a coincidence!

JepePepe · Mar 2, 2014

freyjoel said:
JepePepe said:

There are several good example videos out there where the Phantom just decides to start climbing the stratossphere I cant see how that would be a pilot error.

Phantom is a mass produced and agressively priced unit. And it could be as simple as being bad QC at the factory. But I think that is higly irresponsible considering it is an airial vehicle capable of climbing way up above clouds and able to gain a lot of momentum when out of control.

I dont want to read in the paper when one of these smashes into a turbine of an airliner. This could happend even if you didnt fly it in the proximity of airfield. As it has 20 min flight time it can travel quite a distance full speed in that time.

People who fly UAVs are usually taking safety very seriously (at least they used to) so I belive that should also be a major factor for the manufacturers too. Not to hide bedind just blaming pilot error. (which ofcourse causes some crashes especially now when the hobby speads like bushfire)

Click to expand...

I must suck at searching youtube because I'm not finding this massive amount of P2 non-vision flyaways that clearly show the operator did nothing wrong. Could please link a few examples (in particular those with iosd data showing would be most helpful)?

I guess you must then. But since I am such a nice guy I can point you to the right direction

freyjoel · Mar 2, 2014

Video 1 NOT a P2 Non Vision.
Video 2 NOT a P2 Non Vision (also mentions a previous crash)
Video 3 NOT a P2 Non Vision

Dude you're losing even more credibility here...I'll keep watching...back soon.

Video 4 NOT a P2 Non Vision
Video 5 NOT a P2 Non Vision (also admits a previous crash)
Video 6 NOT a P2 Non Vision (also using carbon fiber non-stock props)
Video 7 NOT a P2 Non Vision (also lost visual orientation)
Video 8 NOT a P2 Non Vision
Video 9 NOT a P2 Non Vision

Do you see a trend here? You don't pay attention to detail. It's not surprising you crashed your Phantom. You're complaining about Phantom 2 Non-Vision's but none of your posts show a P2 Non-Vision flyaway. I am sure there are P2 Non-Vision flyaways but I still bet 90% of the are operator error. Haven't seen a P2 Non-Vision flyaway to date that conclusively proves no operator error.

Tawd77 or I will glady buy your parts. You really need to stick to a hobby that requires less attention to detail.

JepePepe · Mar 2, 2014

You made the claim, why won't you answer the simple question that I asked?

How did you determine that every other RC helicopter can handle "phones and wifis" and what flight controller are all of those other RC helicopters using?

Sir, I suggest you to read again. If it doesnt help perhaps I apologize my english. Or maybe you just have a bad attitude?

tawd77 · Mar 2, 2014

So JepePepe, its obvious that your not a Phantom fan, but I am and could use yours for parts. Want to sell it, or are you happy not recouping some of your loss?

Freyjoel is correct, there is a very low occurance of flyaways with the Phantom 2 non Vision. Unforunately, most of the "flyaways" seem to be due to operator error, and just not reading the online manual in full before your first flight. Im not saying that yours didnt flyaway on its own, but most "flyaways" were unknowingly told to fly away by their owner... It will do what you tell it, so you gotta make sure your speaking the same language as the quad.

freyjoel · Mar 2, 2014

JepePepe said:
freyjoel said:

JepePepe said:

There are several good example videos out there where the Phantom just decides to start climbing the stratossphere I cant see how that would be a pilot error.

Phantom is a mass produced and agressively priced unit. And it could be as simple as being bad QC at the factory. But I think that is higly irresponsible considering it is an airial vehicle capable of climbing way up above clouds and able to gain a lot of momentum when out of control.

I dont want to read in the paper when one of these smashes into a turbine of an airliner. This could happend even if you didnt fly it in the proximity of airfield. As it has 20 min flight time it can travel quite a distance full speed in that time.

People who fly UAVs are usually taking safety very seriously (at least they used to) so I belive that should also be a major factor for the manufacturers too. Not to hide bedind just blaming pilot error. (which ofcourse causes some crashes especially now when the hobby speads like bushfire)

Click to expand...

I must suck at searching youtube because I'm not finding this massive amount of P2 non-vision flyaways that clearly show the operator did nothing wrong. Could please link a few examples (in particular those with iosd data showing would be most helpful)?

Click to expand...

I guess you must then. But since I am such a nice guy I can point you to the right direction

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SAzuaLLs3wo

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kGglPI3ndl4

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=znATkv1ICvs

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZOXDaZfLIUc

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ST7x6KhofDE

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CzFmDdj ... ssLD5iTBfH

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f9H3Ods ... ssLD5iTBfH

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m22qzGKk5MQ

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RCt-XluLyA0

And a finally a true and honest pilot error for you gents to see what that looks like and differs from "The Mad Phantom Phenomena":
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-uKwRI-PELk

Saved for posterity so it can't be edited.

RogerClark · Mar 2, 2014

I just thought I'd post this to the FlyAways thread as its vaguely linked.

I kept loosing contact with my Phantom 2, even flying very close range. It just seemed to happen after between 5 and 10 mins.

Fortunately the Phantom went into RTH and I'd made sure that the home point had been set (more on this later).

Anyway, in my case I initially thought it was interference, but its transpired to be a fault in the RC TX unit, where it seems to fail after between 5 and 10 mins, but if you turn it off and leave it a few mins its OK again.

There are no signs on the RC unit its self that anything is wrong, the only thing noticeable is that you loose control of the Phantom and it thankfully in my case, has gone into RFH.

I'm hoping to get a replacement RC transmitter, but I'm still waiting for the dealer to get back to me about it.

However it doesn't give me much faith in he build quality of either the RC transmitter or the RC receiver and I'm highly likely to swap over to using a Futaba and replace the internal receiver with the Futaba one.

I've not taken the top off my Phantom 2, but I've seen several videos which seem to show the receiver as just a PCB with some chips on it - which is likely to mean its likely susceptible to interference from on-board and external sources.

On the note about setting the Home position. Its probably been noted before, but I've noticed that my P2 seems to do the Home position light sequence twice.
It appears to do it once when its got either 4 or 5 satellites, I presume its got a 2D fix at this point.
It then seems to do the quick flash green again when its got the max number of satellites (6 or more ??), I presume its then go a 3D fix.

IMHO there are a number of design errors with only having the flashing lights on the bottom of the P2. As basically you have to lie on the ground next to the P2 watching the lights in order to wait for the rapid flashing green to indicate home position has been logged. I guess you could just rely on the constant flashing green and assume that its done the home position fix stuff, but being ultra cautious I like to see the flashes myself.

It would be better if the firmware just caused the phantom to do a few beeps though its tinny little speaker when it had home lock.

freyjoel · Mar 2, 2014

RogerClark said:
I just thought I'd post this to the FlyAways thread as its vaguely linked.

I kept loosing contact with my Phantom 2, even flying very close range. It just seemed to happen after between 5 and 10 mins.

Fortunately the Phantom went into RTH and I'd made sure that the home point had been set (more on this later).

Anyway, in my case I initially thought it was interference, but its transpired to be a fault in the RC TX unit, where it seems to fail after between 5 and 10 mins, but if you turn it off and leave it a few mins its OK again.

There are no signs on the RC unit its self that anything is wrong, the only thing noticeable is that you loose control of the Phantom and it thankfully in my case, has gone into RFH.

I'm hoping to get a replacement RC transmitter, but I'm still waiting for the dealer to get back to me about it.

However it doesn't give me much faith in he build quality of either the RC transmitter or the RC receiver and I'm highly likely to swap over to using a Futaba and replace the internal receiver with the Futaba one.

I've not taken the top off my Phantom 2, but I've seen several videos which seem to show the receiver as just a PCB with some chips on it - which is likely to mean its likely susceptible to interference from on-board and external sources.

On the note about setting the Home position. Its probably been noted before, but I've noticed that my P2 seems to do the Home position light sequence twice.
It appears to do it once when its got either 4 or 5 satellites, I presume its got a 2D fix at this point.
It then seems to do the quick flash green again when its got the max number of satellites (6 or more ??), I presume its then go a 3D fix.

IMHO there are a number of design errors with only having the flashing lights on the bottom of the P2. As basically you have to lie on the ground next to the P2 watching the lights in order to wait for the rapid flashing green to indicate home position has been logged. I guess you could just rely on the constant flashing green and assume that its done the home position fix stuff, but being ultra cautious I like to see the flashes myself.

It would be better if the firmware just caused the phantom to do a few beeps though its tinny little speaker when it had home lock.

Good to hear RTH is working properly. Let us know what happens when you get a new TX. I'd hold out for trying a new DJI TX first. It's strange but the DJI TX's seem to have as good if not better range than the Futaba's. Almost jumped to a Futaba my self but I've been getting out to more than 2000 meters with not having it go into RTH. Others have been out to more than 3000 meters and still maintain good control with a stock TX.

RogerClark · Mar 2, 2014

I've emailed both DJI and my dealer, yesterday, but have not had any responses yet.

Going to a Futaba is not really my preferred option, as the minimum cost is around $400, and I don't think there is an option to have both sicks centering on the futaba, and that I'd need to get a centering kit and fit it after I got the futaba.

However if neither DJI or the dealer will fix this, it may be my only option.

BTW. Yes. RTH worked well, but I've actually swapped it to just land where it is, at the moment, as I'm just flying around the local football field and its less worrying that it shooting up to 60ft and going back to the home point.

freyjoel · Mar 2, 2014

RogerClark said:
I've emailed both DJI and my dealer, yesterday, but have not had any responses yet.

Going to a Futaba is not really my preferred option, as the minimum cost is around $400, and I don't think there is an option to have both sicks centering on the futaba, and that I'd need to get a centering kit and fit it after I got the futaba.

However if neither DJI or the dealer will fix this, it may be my only option.

BTW. Yes. RTH worked well, but I've actually swapped it to just land where it is, at the moment, as I'm just flying around the local football field and its less worrying that it shooting up to 60ft and going back to the home point.

I know this is obvious and you've probably done it but how about...new TX batteries? Or...All firmware totally up to date?

ghinson · Mar 2, 2014

My fly-away story is now a few pages old in this thread. (And I am still waiting to hear how DJI support will respond to my answers on the form they sent.)

Whereas I am quite certain that my crash (in the ocean) was due to some sort of mechanical failure, and not pilot error (don't judge the statement unless you go back and read the story), I also agree that it is crazy to think that there is as high a failure rate that has been discussed here these last couple of pages.

That said, I did get a Phantom 1 a couple of months before getting the Phantom 2 and, after flying it without issues for about 2 weeks, during one flight, it ascended to about 50 ft, and suddenly and completely and without warning, lost all power and fell to the ground (asphalt), breaking one of the arms. In that case, I had bought it from Amazon, so I simply returned it and got another.

I have since flown that Phantom probably 75 times without incident.

And now, after flying the Phantom 2 about 100 times for a couple of months, I lost it too.

So, while I agree that these are generally reliable, I do have to say, I'm starting to get a little nervous about it...

av8inglife · Mar 2, 2014

freyjoel said:
Video 1 NOT a P2 Non Vision.
Video 2 NOT a P2 Non Vision (also mentions a previous crash)
Video 3 NOT a P2 Non Vision

Dude you're losing even more credibility here...I'll keep watching...back soon.

Video 4 NOT a P2 Non Vision
Video 5 NOT a P2 Non Vision (also admits a previous crash)
Video 6 NOT a P2 Non Vision (also using carbon fiber non-stock props)
Video 7 NOT a P2 Non Vision (also lost visual orientation)
Video 8 NOT a P2 Non Vision
Video 9 NOT a P2 Non Vision

Do you see a trend here? You don't pay attention to detail. It's not surprising you crashed your Phantom. You're complaining about Phantom 2 Non-Vision's but none of your posts show a P2 Non-Vision flyaway. I am sure there are P2 Non-Vision flyaways but I still bet 90% of the are operator error. Haven't seen a P2 Non-Vision flyaway to date that conclusively proves no operator error.

Tawd77 or I will glady buy your parts. You really need to stick to a hobby that requires less attention to detail.

It's been a while since I've laughed out loud after reading a post as well put as this one. :lol: :lol: :lol:

RogerClark · Mar 2, 2014

freyjoel said:
I know this is obvious and you've probably done it but how about...new TX batteries? Or...All firmware totally up to date?

Yes. Tried 2 new sets of brand news batteries. I even verified the voltage being shown in the RC Assistant software was 6V.

And its defiantly just the TX unit, as if I power on the Phatom after leaving the TX running 5 mins, it won't connect, but if I turn it on a few secs after turning on the TX it always works fine.

Its totally repeatable. If I leave the RC TX a few mins to "cool down" etc, then it connects and works for 5 mins before failing again.

I've not timed the exact amount of time before failure, I guess I should do that with a stopwatch, and see if its always 6 minutes or something.

Its almost like something is overheating and failing. Or perhaps just heating up enough for some bad soldering to break contact, this is quite a classic fault in electronics.

I used to work in the electronics industry and we used to use can's of aerosol freezer, to spray on individual chips on boards which had this sort of problem.
By cooling specific parts of the board, we could isolate where the fault was, and then replace the chip.

However, I don't have any that freezer stuff, and even if I did, part of the board in the TX is a sub module with a metal covering box, which didn't look like it could be easily removed.

If DJI and my dealer are unwilling to help out (still waiting for replies to my emails), I may buy a can of freezer and give it a go, but all of the chips in the unit are surface mount, which normally needs special soldering tools to fix (a re-flow station), and the chips have been painted over, either to disguise what they are, or more likely to provide some basic protection in case it rains on the TX unit