How many people depend on FPV?

[phantom3menace]

I've read plenty of people say how we should never depend on FPV and how we should only depend on LOS for flying our aircrafts. This is very difficult for people like myself that wear eyeglasses and I can't see too far distances anyway. I usually only fly pretty close so I can do LOS but there are times that I like to go farther to get those good lake shots and whatnot.

So I wonder how many other people may be out there who depend on FPV just like myself?

 

[Dronebow]

Well... For me I use FPV quite a lot. And LOS gets pretty weak past a few hundred yards at best. Too difficult to see which way the P3 is pointed and all. LOS is fine to let you know where you are but I completely lose sight of it after about 1700 feet and this thing can apparently go another 4000'+ after that so the whole LOS argument seems to lose out on that note alone. My $.02

:-D

 

[GadgetGuy]

There is a difference between LOS and actually seeing the aircraft, which can depend upon your eyesight, distance to the craft, weather conditions, and magnification, such as use of binoculars. The key part of LOS is maintaining transmitter control and FPV transmission. If anything is obstructing that LOS, transmitter control will suffer. On the other hand, even if you cannot see the aircraft, as long as it is on an unobstructed LOS, you should be fine. You need to be flying high enough to avoid all ground based obstacles, if you can no longer see the craft, and intend to fly based upon FPV alone. Ideally, you have spotter with you, using image stabilized binoculars, following the aircraft. Alternatively, mounting binoculars on a tripod, that you can switch to looking through, can help. As long as you can see the compass orientation in the Pilot app, you will always know the aircraft nose orientation, so you will know whether you are flying towards yourself or away from yourself, even if can't see the aircraft. That will always enable you to bring it back, to physically see the aircraft, as needed, especially for landing, as the battery gets low. Happy and safe flying, out of view, but within LOS!

 

[NickCopter]

I always use FPV. Very rarely do I fly within eyesight. The only time I can think of when I fly within LOS is if I'm at a very crowded area (ie beach during 4th of July) where odds are good that cops might come and talk to me.

 

[Foosy]

I really like @GadgetGuy definition. Too many of us think that LOS is too restrictive because we falsely believe that we must see the UAV. In fact, LOS can exist as long as there is an unobstructed line between you and the UAV.
So according to this definition, lifting the UAV as high as possible is NOT considered LOS, even if it is relatively close to you, if there is an obstruction as in the following image.

 

[GadgetGuy]

Without FPV, you have to be able to see the aircraft to control it. However, just because you can see it, doesn't necessaily mean you can immediately control it without FPV. Even if you can see it, without FPV, you still first need to determine the craft's orientation, relative to you, to be able to control it. At a safe altitude, I would much rather have FPV for immediate control than visual sight. If the aircraft has the sun behind it, only FPV will get the job done!

Here is Webster's definition of "Line of Sight":
2: the line between two points; specifically: the straight path between a transmitting antenna (as for radio or television signals) and a receiving antenna when unobstructed by the horizon

So, LOS does not require being able to also see the aircraft. Seeing is optional!

 

[ScottyT]

I think many would rely on FPV when the quad get's too far away. As for the definition of LOS it will depend on the context, not some arbitrary dictionary definition.

In the context of UAV flying I expect most ruling bodies will be referring to VLOS with regards to guidelines and safety.

http://www.acuo.org.au/industry-information/terminology/how-do-we-see-them/

 

[dalebb]

I do, how are you going to get the shots you want without it?

 

[Ingsoc75]

I wouldn't even fly a drone without FPV. It would get boring after a few minutes.

 

[GadgetGuy]

Flying without FPV is like wearing a sleep mask while flying. Good for sleeping, but takes all the fun out of seeing what is happening outside the window!

 

[GadgetGuy]

I think many would rely on FPV when the quad get's too far away. As for the definition of LOS it will depend on the context, not some arbitrary dictionary definition.

In the context of UAV flying I expect most ruling bodies will be referring to VLOS with regards to guidelines and safety.

http://www.acuo.org.au/industry-information/terminology/how-do-we-see-them/

Some countries do have visual line of sight restrictions! Here in the USA, we are not yet so burdened! Knock on wood!

 

[snerd]

The compass in the app should always show the craft's orientation. Doesn't everyone use it?

 

[ScottyT]

The compass in the app should always show the craft's orientation. Doesn't everyone use it?

You're still reliant on the app to do your navigating. If the app or phone crashes (and yes I know there has not been one documented case of that ever happening) you have to fly the craft using vision and sticks alone.

 

[snerd]

You're still reliant on the app to do your navigating. If the app or phone crashes (and yes I know there has not been one documented case of that ever happening) you have to fly the craft using vision and sticks alone.

Yes, I understand that. I was replying in regards to some saying they needed to "see" the craft LOS to figure out its orientation.

ETA: I just realized what was being said. A DUH moment, sorry!

 

[ScottyT]

Some countries do have visual line of sight restrictions! Here in the USA, we are not yet so burdened! Knock on wood!

Yes, not yet. The safety guidelines of the AMA, which is linked to from the FAA site already include "Keep your sUAS in eyesight at all times, and use an observer to assist if needed" .

Only a matter of time I expect - especially with numb skulls posting their videos online vying for distance 'records'. What could possibly go wrong?

 

[Richard in ky]

LOS can get you into trouble also, It can appear that you are a lot higher than a smoke stack when you are a way from it then all of a sudden you hit the darn thing. Had to run home and order me a new one and I will wait for parts to become available to fix it.

 

[snowghost]

There is a difference between LOS and actually seeing the aircraft, which can depend upon your eyesight, distance to the craft, weather conditions, and magnification, such as use of binoculars. The key part of LOS is maintaining transmitter control and FPV transmission. If anything is obstructing that LOS, transmitter control will suffer. On the other hand, even if you cannot see the aircraft, as long as it is on an unobstructed LOS, you should be fine. You need to be flying high enough to avoid all ground based obstacles, if you can no longer see the craft, and intend to fly based upon FPV alone. Ideally, you have spotter with you, using image stabilized binoculars, following the aircraft. Alternatively, mounting binoculars on a tripod, that you can switch to looking through, can help. As long as you can see the compass orientation in the Pilot app, you will always know the aircraft nose orientation, so you will know whether you are flying towards yourself or away from yourself, even if can't see the aircraft. That will always enable you to bring it back, to physically see the aircraft, as needed, especially for landing, as the battery gets low. Happy and safe flying, out of view, but within LOS!

Dude. How many people are going to have a tripod for binoculars.

 

[MattyDread]

Dude. How many people are going to have a tripod for binoculars.

He's not called 'Gadget Guy' for nothing!

 

[SteveMann]

Yes, not yet. The safety guidelines of the AMA, which is linked to from the FAA site already include "Keep your sUAS in eyesight at all times, and use an observer to assist if needed" .

Only a matter of time I expect - especially with numb skulls posting their videos online vying for distance 'records'. What could possibly go wrong?

No, it's a matter of process, not the FAA spending scarce resources on YouTube looking for people not violating any rules. LOS has been the plan since 2012 (FAA Modernization and Reform Act of 2012). When the Part 107 rules are finalized, Section 336, 'Special Rule For Model Aircraft' will be the codified in the rules. It says:

(c) MODEL AIRCRAFT DEFINED.—In this section, the term ‘‘model aircraft’’ means an unmanned aircraft that is—
(1) capable of sustained flight in the atmosphere;
(2) flown within visual line of sight of the person operating the aircraft; and
(3) flown for hobby or recreational purposes
​

This was 2012, before the explosive growth in personal drones really got going.

 

[ScottyT]

No, it's a matter of process, not the FAA spending scarce resources on YouTube looking for people not violating any rules. LOS has been the plan since 2012 (FAA Modernization and Reform Act of 2012). When the Part 107 rules are finalized, Section 336, 'Special Rule For Model Aircraft' will be the codified in the rules. It says:

(c) MODEL AIRCRAFT DEFINED.—In this section, the term ‘‘model aircraft’’ means an unmanned aircraft that is—
(1) capable of sustained flight in the atmosphere;
(2) flown within visual line of sight of the person operating the aircraft; and
(3) flown for hobby or recreational purposes
​

This was 2012, before the explosive growth in personal drones really got going.

yeah, yeah...I've seen your legalese strewn everywhere. Good luck with that bro. You must be a real hoot at dinner parties.