Hover app and Class D airspace

[Ebjerke]

I am a recreational drone flyer. I was flying today and DJI GO 4 said I was in Class D area. Since the Hover app showed that I WAS NOT within five miles of the airport, I didn't think anything of it. Why did I get that notification and what should i have done about it? My guess is that it doesn't apply to me because I am not commercial flying with a 107, but I am a real newbie, so I really don't know. Thanks!

 

[dirkclod]

Have had that app tell me I was in NFZ before when I was not .
Think it's strange sometimes .

 

[BigAl07]

As a part 101 (Hobby/Recreational) flyer you need to be concerned with both. Let me explain:

Hobby/Recreational you are required to make notification prior to flight 5 mile or less within controlled airspace except B or BRAVO in which you are required to get ATC approval prior to entering BRAVO airspace. So you'll need to know what distance you are from the ARP (Airport Reference Point) as well as what airspace you are attempting to fly in.

If you were not within 5 miles of the airport you really didn't need to do anything except fly safely and keep your eyes and ears open. It's your responsibility to do whatever it takes to not interfere with manned aviation in any way.

Keep this in mind... if any part of your flight falls outside of Hobby/Recreational guidelines as set forth in Part 101, your flight defaults to Part 107 Rules/Law which are fully enforceable and can carry a heavy fine/penalty.

Good luck and SAFE flights

 

[dirkclod]

Still a strange app sometimes

 

[BigAl07]

Still a strange app sometimes

Oh I agree completely. You'd think the maps were pretty reliable because it's built off of AirMap.

 

[Ebjerke]

As a part 101 (Hobby/Recreational) flyer you need to be concerned with both. Let me explain:

Hobby/Recreational you are required to make notification prior to flight 5 mile or less within controlled airspace except B or BRAVO in which you are required to get ATC approval prior to entering BRAVO airspace. So you'll need to know what distance you are from the ARP (Airport Reference Point) as well as what airspace you are attempting to fly in.

If you were not within 5 miles of the airport you really didn't need to do anything except fly safely and keep your eyes and ears open. It's your responsibility to do whatever it takes to not interfere with manned aviation in any way.

Keep this in mind... if any part of your flight falls outside of Hobby/Recreational guidelines as set forth in Part 101, your flight defaults to Part 107 Rules/Law which are fully enforceable and can carry a heavy fine/penalty.

Good luck and SAFE flights

Thanks for the response! It is so interesting to me--if I understand you correctly--that if you have Part 107 you have way more restrictions and it is much more difficult to fly legally. It seems like you would have more privileges if you had part 107, but it seems as if you have fewer! What am I missing?

 

[umanbean]

Think of it like this:

It's my understanding that every UAS operator flies under Part 107 unless 'inside' the Hobby/Rec bubble.

Once you step outside that, you are strictly under 107... but if you follow all the Part 101 rules and stay inside the bubble, you are somewhat "exempt" from some 107 restrictions.

The above is a somewhat fast-and-loose explanation, so please don't try it in court. If any of it is incorrect, I hope someone in the know will come along and correct.

 

[BigAl07]

Thanks for the response! It is so interesting to me--if I understand you correctly--that if you have Part 107 you have way more restrictions and it is much more difficult to fly legally. It seems like you would have more privileges if you had part 107, but it seems as if you have fewer! What am I missing?

You understand correct. Back in 2012 some very powerful (wealthy) people went to Congress and "Lobbied" on behalf of the R/C hobbyists in the US. Congress decided to "protect" the hobby/recreational fliers and they carved what we call Part 101 out of the Rules & Regulations and mandated that the FAA can not enact any new laws/rules on hobby/recreational operations unless it improves NAS safety. Basically this means that if you do everything within the framework of Part 101 then you have much fewer restrictions against you.

To put it bluntly... our Congress was short sighted and screwed the pooch when they did this. It created such the perfect storm in regards to confusing regulations and basically created the Wild Wild West in terms of sUAS flights. In their defense they didn't know enough about what they were referencing to make an intelligent decision so they put grease on the squeaky wheel to make it go away.

I fully expect the Model Aircraft Reform Act of 2012 to be completely repealed in the not too distant future and I personally feel like it needs to be done sooner than later. At that time you'll see regulations (that are codified into law) be applied to hobby/recreational operators just like Civil (Part 107) operators.

 

[Ebjerke]

You understand correct. Back in 2012 some very powerful (wealthy) people went to Congress and "Lobbied" on behalf of the R/C hobbyists in the US. Congress decided to "protect" the hobby/recreational fliers and they carved what we call Part 101 out of the Rules & Regulations and mandated that the FAA can not enact any new laws/rules on hobby/recreational operations unless it improves NAS safety. Basically this means that if you do everything within the framework of Part 101 then you have much fewer restrictions against you.

To put it bluntly... our Congress was short sighted and screwed the pooch when they did this. It created such the perfect storm in regards to confusing regulations and basically created the Wild Wild West in terms of sUAS flights. In their defense they didn't know enough about what they were referencing to make an intelligent decision so they put grease on the squeaky wheel to make it go away.

I fully expect the Model Aircraft Reform Act of 2012 to be completely repealed in the not too distant future and I personally feel like it needs to be done sooner than later. At that time you'll see regulations (that are codified into law) be applied to hobby/recreational operators just like Civil (Part 107) operators.

Wow, this kind of blows me away. Thanks for the info. Where is the best place for me to really understand all the implications? I thought that I might want to get my 107 and do some business-related drone stuff, not I am not sure. I don't need a job, but I do some side photography business now and then and thought that somehow this might be an additional thing I could dabble in, but now it seems that doing so would make it harder for me to do stuff recreationally.

 

[umanbean]

Don't let it blow you away, it's not as complicated as it may seem... There is no one place you can go to learn it all, but I've learned TONS reading here daily since early April. And the FAA UAS FAQ website has links to all the rules and regs.

but now it seems that doing so would make it harder for me to do stuff recreationally.

Not at all. The way these nutty regs are written, you can hold a 107 and still fly Hobby/Rec - as long as you stay within the Hobby/Rec rules!

To wit:

Let's say I have my 107 ticket. My BIL lives within 5 miles of a controlled airport. I go to his house on July 4th to get some cool vids of the family, and post them to my Facebook or Instagram. Since the flight is purely hobby/recreational, I call the airport to inform them of my flight plans.

If I go to my BILs house the next day because he wants to put it up for sale, and wants me to video the house and grounds so he can put it on Zillow, I'm outside Hobby/Rec rules, so 107 applies. So now I call the airport and ask for permission to fly.

That's way overly simplistic, and many caveats apply, but - If you hold a 107, you can still fly under Hobby/Rec rules.

Clear as mud ain't it?

 

[BigAl07]

@umanbean pretty much nailed it in a very simplistic way.

Keep these points in mind:

A) Hobbyist "notifies" tower or controlling agency(tower, airport manager etc) if flying within 5 miles of an airport (airspace doesn't matter except Class B in which they must get permission before entering into BRAVO). Except as noted above in BRAVO, you are merely notifying of your intentions and not asking permission but the agency CAN deny and insist you not fly. If you go against that you could be facing local, state and Federal repercussions so that's a choice you and only you can make. They are only supposed to deny the flight if it causes a threat to NAS in some way. If it truly does and you fly any way don't be surprised if you're met with local authorities and cited or more.

B) Part 107 doesn't contact the tower to fly at a controlled airport. They have to get Airspace Approval via the online web portal which could take 90+ days so plan way ahead. Some of the approval "Authorizations/Waivers" do require tower notification 30min prior to the flight but that is clearly spelled out in each individual authorization/waiver.

C) Part 107 can fly under Part 107 or Part 101 (hobby) rules but whatever you take off flying under the entire flight must be flown according to that designation. You can NOT mix & match the two in flight.

D) Part 107 can fly as hobbyist but hobbyist can NOT fly as Part 107.

E) As of this writing, December 12th, 2017 8:12am (EST) hobby aircraft are NOT required to be registered with the FAA. This is about to change any day now so be sure to research thoroughly if you are new or deciding to register or not. Personally I think ALL sUAS over .55lbs SHOULD be registered but that's my 2 cents.

F) A sUAS that is being flown under Part 107 is legally required to be registered with the FAA as a Commercial Aircraft and identified as such.

G) An aircraft registered with the FAA as a Commercial Aircraft CAN be flown for hobby/recreation with no additional registration/processing required.

H) An aircraft registered with the FAA as a HOBBY Aircraft (or unregistered) CAN be flown for Hobby and ONLY Hobby flights.

I) Part 101 (hobby) UAS operations are a subset of Part 107 Operations. If any portion of your flight does not fit perfectly within the definition of Part 101 your entire flight defaults to Part 107 Rules and are enforceable as such.