The main issue is not the the ground, it's airspace. Air safely is proactive, you don't wait for a plane to crash to figure out how to prevent it.
Don't they have to abide by section 336?
DJI has abandoned professionals
- Thread starter Drestin Black
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The main issue is not the the ground, it's airspace. Air safely is proactive, you don't wait for a plane to crash to figure out how to prevent it.
Don't they have to abide by section 336?
DJI is a business and they want to sell more drones. Driving away the current customer base is counter productive to their bottom line. They may be in the People's Republic, but they want to make money. When they block a 107 license holder from flying, there is a cost to that license holder. Losing commercial customers will hit DJI harder than losing hobbyist fliers.
There is a lot of noise about terrorists using drones to deliver mortars, idiots flying too close to airports, and other idiots flying too close to people's homes. You can debate the seriousness of the actions, but it's happening and that is what is showing up in the news. DJI (and other UAV companies) does not want to see more restrictive laws put into place. That has to be a larger part of the reasoning with why they made the geofencing much more restrictive.
I think it's just a matter of time before DJI includes ADS-B technology in the hobbyist line of drones. They already have that in the commercial drones like the M200. If the drones are identifiable to aviation authorities, that accomplishes a few things. First off, it lets them know that there are UAVs in the neighborhood, but flying safely. They don't have to worry about those pilots. It also identifies UAVs flying in places where they shouldn't be (at a fire, too low over a swimming pool, etc). If you make the UAVs more accountable, then you can give them more responsibility. That's one of the reasons that trying to compare a UAV with a car doesn't really work. You need to have license plates, registration, and insurance with the car.
The drawback is that you'll need a drone that has the ADS-B as part of the system or retrofitted so that the firmware sees it. I would like see some official DJI participation at a conference where they could take questions and engage in a dialog to talk about where they are going with the geofencing.
There is a lot of noise about terrorists using drones to deliver mortars, idiots flying too close to airports, and other idiots flying too close to people's homes. You can debate the seriousness of the actions, but it's happening and that is what is showing up in the news. DJI (and other UAV companies) does not want to see more restrictive laws put into place. That has to be a larger part of the reasoning with why they made the geofencing much more restrictive.
I think it's just a matter of time before DJI includes ADS-B technology in the hobbyist line of drones. They already have that in the commercial drones like the M200. If the drones are identifiable to aviation authorities, that accomplishes a few things. First off, it lets them know that there are UAVs in the neighborhood, but flying safely. They don't have to worry about those pilots. It also identifies UAVs flying in places where they shouldn't be (at a fire, too low over a swimming pool, etc). If you make the UAVs more accountable, then you can give them more responsibility. That's one of the reasons that trying to compare a UAV with a car doesn't really work. You need to have license plates, registration, and insurance with the car.
The drawback is that you'll need a drone that has the ADS-B as part of the system or retrofitted so that the firmware sees it. I would like see some official DJI participation at a conference where they could take questions and engage in a dialog to talk about where they are going with the geofencing.
Note that the ADS-B in the M200 is only a receiver - it's not broadcasting.
The only other comment I'd make is that in terms of DJI's consumer range of aircraft, I doubt that commercial customers are going to drive their product development since they are far outnumbered by hobbyist users. If you look at the direction that DJI is taking in the enterprise sector then I think it's clear that they understand the professional user market quite well, and that is where their non-recreational focus will be.
Noted, it's used to identify nearby aircraft. I would not be surprised if they were working on a low power ADS-B transmitter that go in across the product line.
100% agree with op, I own a certified airplane, and I can fly it wherever I want in theory. I as a pilot need to follow the rules or my certificate can be reworked. Cessna is not controlling where I can or cannot fly.
The difference is that you had to study and test for your pilot's license. Your plane is certified and you follow the rules. And you are in complete control of the aircraft at all times.
Your drone flying use case is not the problem. It's the people who can go out to a store, buy a drone and the immediately start flying it with disregard to the rules and acceptable behavior that created the environment that we are in.
The current situation sucks, but if someone has a better idea that DJI can use to help eliminate the environment of FUD that is generating the laws and restrictions being added to the books, send it to DJI.
Self certified mostly, I certify my drone when I go to take off. I inspect what I can, then rely on the internal self tests.
Follow the rules? Says who? They are just as likely to follow or not follow as any other human. They have the choice to do so because they have complete control over their aircraft. It can be flown lawfully or outright dangerously, and the rest of us won't know until after it happens.
You can't legislate behavior. More rules does not equal more compliance, ask the gun folks on both sides about this. People will do what they will with guns, legal or not, rules or not. Same with aircraft, of any size.
You are implying that because drones are cheaper than full sized airplanes that the type of person who affords one is somehow morally superior to the other? Let's assume you aren't and not go there.
Legislation has never controlled anything. Make as many speeding laws as you'd like but people will speed. Make drunk driving laws as harsh as you'd like but people will still do so, and kill people in the process. And these things so not tarnish the car industry. Because you can be a drunk speeder in a Ford doesn't make ford either liable or look bad.
I have no problem requiring training and a license to fly. I don't think it'll change things much but it'll make some people feel better. HOWEVER, what I resist as strongly as possible is someone or something else taking control of MY aircraft. I am the pilot, I choose what to do. As long as there is even one single good reason for someone to fly somewhere, that's enough. You can't possible predict all the reasons someone need to fly somewhere.
A pilot should always always always be in full control of his aircraft. Period. DJI, get your hands off my controller. And no sneaky putting backdoor controls in VI's required firmware updates.
The exact contrary here, in France. Airport NFZ are never circular but they are much more extended in the axis of runways than the DJI's ones. The pure NFZ is always accompanied by restricted altitude zones on its sides. Moroeover there is a lot of small airports that are not listed in the DJI's geofencing (two in my immediate neighbouring) and the huge NFZ around military airports are treated by DJI as are their tiny NFZ around civil airports.
Thus, at least in France, no one can trust in the DJI's NFZ for flying and it represent a false security.
The solution, if DJI won't drop Geo entirely, is to simply have an on/off switch for it, just like EVERY system on any aircraft. Want it, use it. Don't want it? Turn it off.
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Most of the gripes are understands. But the simplicity some of you don't see is public safety. Period. It trumps where you think you can fly. And if a government says 5 miles from a airport or any other place they seem important. It's their option. And far as opinions. Every one has one. But it does not matter. The simple fact is you can't fly in certain areas. If you hd a. Client. Go there before hand. And see if no fly zone. You can always use the toy type with no restrictions but control is another thing.
You are ignoring the fact that someone can go out and study for and pass a test and get a license as a "real" aircraft pilot -- then immediately jump aboard a plane and fly into NFZs, buzz through TFRs, disobey every rule and law... nothing stops them whatsoever. And they are in craft big enough to do real harm! Why? Because, no matter what, the pilot is always in charge. So, big planes or small drones, its down to the pilot and no amount of legislation will ever force a pilot to behave responsibly, it's his own duty to do so. If the FAA doesn't feel that huge gas filled 500 mph flying bombs with passengers don't need a Geo system to protect them from themselves, little plastic toy drones don't either.
What is more dangerous, a gulf stream jet, cesna, bell helicopter, etc or your little drone?
So. Why don't those craft have a Geo type system. They can fly right into any nfz or TFR without blinking an eye. Public safety ignored?
I have Three DJI Drones and 2 Parrot drones, The Parrot Drones are not Geo-Blocked. True the Parrot does not have a 4K camera, but if you are shooting Real-Estate please tell me why you need a 4K camera. If you are shooting a local TV commercial please tell my why you need a 4K camera.... well you don't If you are doing 3D imaging you dont need a 4K camera either. My Parrot BeeBop 2 has a range of a mile and half, and will fit in a standard business brief case. I do use my DJI 4 and Inspire. I use them for Movies and TV shows I do, funny though the studios down covert to HD from 4K...
I've read the thread, and haven't seen any comments about using the Litchi app. I have a P4 and haven't updated my firmware. I have updated the app, hoping it fixes the app crashing all the time. I am now using the Litchi app and haven't had any problems. I guess at some point DJI may brick my drone if I don't update the firmware. I use my drone for real estate work, and don't want to be in a situation where the drone won't fly. Maybe I should eBay my P4 and but something else. Bad enough it took transport Canada 7 months to approve a simple flight, but now having to fight with DJI is just too much. I already have problems with Android and DJI. I won't use an apple product because they are just like DJI in my opinion. I want control over what I own.
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The vessel matters not. Public perception above all. If they think some yokel is endangering public. Boom. Restrictions. Although that yokel can be very safe. It's re way things are. Most that don't like it. Can run for office and change it. If they can. Complaining never caused change. It's like whistling in the wind.
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I do not have any geo issues with my Yuneec aircraft.
The P4Pro is prevented from flying in much of British Columbia after these recent firmware changes.
My Yuneec Typhoon and H are fine, as are all of our Ardupilot/Pixhawk aircraft.
There are some very good alternatives!
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I'm totally with you, but I think that in order to be able to sell their products in the USA (or Europe), they are required to install NFZ and TFR software restrictions. Might prevent crazy people from deliberately crashing their drones into planes, or the president's golf cart.
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