Why not stay in "Phantom" mode?

[robininni]

I've read quite a few posts and the general vibe I get is that Naza Mode is something you 'graduate' to--something that you use after you learn the ropes--a better place to be. My question: Why is that?

I'm just going to put down a few of my thoughts and you can tell me why I'm wrong or agree with me.

1. You just spent a lot of money for a GPS stabilized RC quadcopter, why in the world would you want to fly it around in 'Attitude' mode? (Oh, I forgot, for the stable 'drift-with-the-wind' video...)

2. Manual Mode? Really? Go buy a cheap quadcopter if you want to fly unassisted.

3. With all the different flying protocols (GPS, Attitude, Manual, Return to Home, IOC Normal, IOC Home Lock, IOC Course Lock) available in Naza Mode at the change of a switch position, do you think this could increase rather than decrease your chances of screwing up? Why would you want to do that?

4. What if your 'fly away' was really that you inadvertently got the Phantom in Course Lock and so it isn't responding 'correctly' to your stick inputs?? Maybe then you panic and switch to Attitude or Manual Mode scared that Return to Home won't work and further confound the issue?

5. I get that the idea of Home Lock being appealing--just pull it back toward you no matter which direction it is facing. What if you are panicking when you use this and forget to only pull back on the right stick? What if you hit something while it is returned to you sideways because that is the last orientation you had it in before using Home Lock? Why not just turn your remote off for a moment, let it Return to Home, where it actually turns and faces you and gives you a very good idea of where it is via the video feed, and then you can switch back on your remote and take control toggling the S1 switch when you feel ready?

I just wonder how many 'fly-aways' and lost Phantoms occurred while the operator was in Naza Mode instead of Phantom mode. My bet would be the answer is a lot. Why not keep it simple? You may get to play with 'Attitude' mode anyway if you lose too many satellites but why would you purposefully choose to dummy down your smart machine?

 

[IrishSights]

Re: Why not stay in "Phantom" mode?

Welll...where do I start. 1st I do videos. Atti mode does away with the micro adjustments that GPS induces to keep it on the spot. Basiclly for me its essential for smooth videos. Course lock is also a good video tool. There are many more advantages for my purposes too long to list just now.

I can understand fully if you want to just enjoy flying your phantom around, but some of us use it for other purposes that require the flexibility of these other modes. Others (a bit of me too) just want to push the envelope and improve their piloting skills.

Sent from my Galaxy Note 8

 

[N017RW]

I've read quite a few posts and the general vibe I get is that Naza Mode is something you 'graduate' to--something that you use after you learn the ropes--a better place to be. My question: Why is that?

I'm just going to put down a few of my thoughts and you can tell me why I'm wrong or agree with me.

1. You just spent a lot of money for a GPS stabilized RC quadcopter, why in the world would you want to fly it around in 'Attitude' mode? (Oh, I forgot, for the stable 'drift-with-the-wind' video...)

2. Manual Mode? Really? Go buy a cheap quadcopter if you want to fly unassisted.

3. With all the different flying protocols (GPS, Attitude, Manual, Return to Home, IOC Normal, IOC Home Lock, IOC Course Lock) available in Naza Mode at the change of a switch position, do you think this could increase rather than decrease your chances of screwing up? Why would you want to do that?

4. What if your 'fly away' was really that you inadvertently got the Phantom in Course Lock and so it isn't responding 'correctly' to your stick inputs?? Maybe then you panic and switch to Attitude or Manual Mode scared that Return to Home won't work and further confound the issue?

5. I get that the idea of Home Lock being appealing--just pull it back toward you no matter which direction it is facing. What if you are panicking when you use this and forget to only pull back on the right stick? What if you hit something while it is returned to you sideways because that is the last orientation you had it in before using Home Lock? Why not just turn your remote off for a moment, let it Return to Home, where it actually turns and faces you and gives you a very good idea of where it is via the video feed, and then you can switch back on your remote and take control toggling the S1 switch when you feel ready?

I just wonder how many 'fly-aways' and lost Phantoms occurred while the operator was in Naza Mode instead of Phantom mode. My bet would be the answer is a lot. Why not keep it simple? You may get to play with 'Attitude' mode anyway if you lose too many satellites but why would you purposefully choose to dummy down your smart machine?

I'm going to speculate and say that you are new to r/c aircraft.

'Protocols' as you call them are tools. You use them or don't, TEHO.

I'm sure you will soon get bored just operating your a/c instead of flying it cause that's all you're doing in Phantom (GPS) mode.

Someday you'll want to 'dummy down' your machine and begin to really FLY it.

Manual is awesome

 

[Madwak]

A lot of the flyaways appear to be due to screwed up GPS, if you stay in phantom mode you are not able to manually switch to ATTI mode to stop the phantom using screwed up GPS readings and turning the controller off to get it to return home ain't gonna work with screwed up GPS that's why people don't just stick to phantom mode, in Naza the options are there if you need them in phantom mode you just have to hope and pray

 

[Dirty Bird]

I agree with IrishSights. You lose so much when you deny yourself NAZA mode's benefits, and all you have to do is remember to begin your flights with both switches up. Home Lock gives you the ability to fly past something while panning your view, or to fly sideways along with something...like a car or a boat...while keeping the camera focused on the subject. You cannot capture shots like that in Vision mode. You are limited to shooting straight ahead.

 

[Sasquatch]

Good answers guys....

Although this was Robininni's post and question(s), as a newbie myself your answers have helped me to better evaluate and understand things from a different perspective and more or less in layman's terms.


Thanks!

 

[Cocoa Beach Kiter]

It is fun to fly and you can take some great pics/video in Phantom mode. And it is REALLY smart to stay in that mode until you have flying down. However... NAZA is equivalent to giving you a lot more options/tools to use if you choose. And it is a way to allow you more speed and control - if you want it.

I think it comes down to preferences. If Phantom mode suits your needs and works for you - than enjoy. If you need the functionality that NAZA provides and desire more control options than go for it.

For me, I flew for quite awhile in Phantom (until I felt really comfortable) then I tried NAZA and to be honest I would never go back. IMHO it is more fun to fly.

Don't rush to judgment until you have spent some time in both modes

 

[robininni]

I'm going to speculate and say that you are new to r/c aircraft.

'Protocols' as you call them are tools. You use them or don't, TEHO.

I'm sure you will soon get bored just operating your a/c instead of flying it cause that's all you're doing in Phantom (GPS) mode.

Someday you'll want to 'dummy down' your machine and begin to really FLY it.

Manual is awesome

I've been flying RC helis for 15 years on and off starting out with a Kyosho Nexus 30 . I guess I just appreciate the technological advances that make things easy.

 

[robininni]

I agree with IrishSights. You lose so much when you deny yourself NAZA mode's benefits, and all you have to do is remember to begin your flights with both switches up. Home Lock gives you the ability to fly past something while panning your view, or to fly sideways along with something...like a car or a boat...while keeping the camera focused on the subject. You cannot capture shots like that in Vision mode. You are limited to shooting straight ahead.

I can fly in one direction while yawing at the same time and changing my right stick control to maintain the direction of travel. I can capture these shots as you describe in "vision' mode (I think you mean Phantom mode) no problem. You don't need Home Lock to do this. Maybe you find it easier this way.

 

[Cocoa Beach Kiter]

I agree with IrishSights. You lose so much when you deny yourself NAZA mode's benefits, and all you have to do is remember to begin your flights with both switches up. Home Lock gives you the ability to fly past something while panning your view, or to fly sideways along with something...like a car or a boat...while keeping the camera focused on the subject. You cannot capture shots like that in Vision mode. You are limited to shooting straight ahead.

I can fly in one direction while yawing at the same time and changing my right stick control to maintain the direction of travel. I can capture these shots as you describe in "vision' mode (I think you mean Phantom mode) no problem. You don't need Home Lock to do this. Maybe you find it easier this way.

Bragger... lol

 

[nhoover]

To me, more options are a good thing. I use ATTI mode a lot, HL a bit and CL occasionally. Besides smoother video, ATTI mode does:

1) Lets you measure the wind speed accurately, at altitude
2) Lets you fly faster (approx 50mph in no wind, and I've gone close to 70mph in a tailwind)

I don't enable manual mode, but maybe will in the future.
I prefer having Failsafe on a switch rather than actually turning off the TX completely.

 

[Sasquatch]

To me, more options are a good thing...

2) Lets you fly faster approx 50mph in no wind, and I've gone close to 70mph in a tailwind)

Wow, wow, WOW!!!!!!!!! close to 70mph!?!?!

 

[skyhighdiver]

To me, more options are a good thing...

2) Lets you fly faster approx 50mph in no wind, and I've gone close to 70mph in a tailwind)

Wow, wow, WOW!!!!!!!!! close to 70mph!?!?!

Me to

 

[N017RW]

I'm going to speculate and say that you are new to r/c aircraft.

'Protocols' as you call them are tools. You use them or don't, TEHO.

I'm sure you will soon get bored just operating your a/c instead of flying it cause that's all you're doing in Phantom (GPS) mode.

Someday you'll want to 'dummy down' your machine and begin to really FLY it.

Manual is awesome

I've been flying RC helis for 15 years on and off starting out with a Kyosho Nexus 30 . I guess I just appreciate the technological advances that make things easy.

No offense intended and appreciate your tempered response.

You'd love manual, flies like your CP Nexus 30 did... with less orientation visibilty!

(I stuck to 450 electrics)

Peace!

 

[Mal_PV2_Ireland]

I'm going to speculate and say that you are new to r/c aircraft.

'Protocols' as you call them are tools. You use them or don't, TEHO.

I'm sure you will soon get bored just operating your a/c instead of flying it cause that's all you're doing in Phantom (GPS) mode.

Someday you'll want to 'dummy down' your machine and begin to really FLY it.

Manual is awesome

I've been flying RC helis for 15 years on and off starting out with a Kyosho Nexus 30 . I guess I just appreciate the technological advances that make things easy.

No offense intended and appreciate your tempered response.

You'd love manual, flies like your CP Nexus 30 did... with less orientation visibilty!

(I stuck to 450 electrics)

Peace!

Haha you're gonna get sued for 20 billion dollars for advising new flyers to try manual mode

 

[Mal_PV2_Ireland]

A lot of the flyaways appear to be due to screwed up GPS, if you stay in phantom mode you are not able to manually switch to ATTI mode to stop the phantom using screwed up GPS readings and turning the controller off to get it to return home ain't gonna work with screwed up GPS that's why people don't just stick to phantom mode, in Naza the options are there if you need them in phantom mode you just have to hope and pray

What drugs are you taking? Can I have some please

99% of flyaways are due to new pilot error, FULL STOP, PERIOD, END OF!!!
I have not seen 1 single piece of video evidence of a TRUE flyaway on a pv2+, ive seen 1 conclusive video of a TRUE flyaway on a pv2 and 5 videos of conclusive flyaways on p1's. So my question is what is your description of a flyaway???
Are you getting them mixed up with "NEW FLYER BLOWAYS" or "OH ****, WHATS ATTI MODE" ??????

Cant wait for your answer......

 

[TeeJayN]

It is fun to fly and you can take some great pics/video in Phantom mode. And it is REALLY smart to stay in that mode until you have flying down. However... NAZA is equivalent to giving you a lot more options/tools to use if you choose. And it is a way to allow you more speed and control - if you want it.

I think it comes down to preferences. If Phantom mode suits your needs and works for you - then enjoy. If you need the functionality that NAZA provides and desire more control options, then go for it.

For me, I flew for quite awhile in Phantom (until I felt really comfortable) then I tried NAZA and to be honest I would never go back. IMHO it is more fun to fly.

Don't rush to judgment until you have spent some time in both modes

+1
The above, IMHO, is excellent advice!
It's pretty cool that these wonderful machines have options that address both Beginner and Advanced users.
I'm staying in the Phantom mode - for now. I'm still working on smooth figure 8's and flying smooth circles around fixed objects - in both directions! That may be easy for you Advanced Guys but it's a real challenge for me - but I am getting much better! (Practice, Practice!!) I look forward to trying/switching to NAZA and figuring out what works best for me!

 

[robininni]

I've flown mine about 30 times. I've never noticed anything less than great holding performance from the Phantom Mode. I have flown mainly in wind, some strong, some light. I have only flown once when calm. It didn't matter. The GPS holds the Phantom 2 Vision+ within <2 meter from where it comes to a stop. I will say that rotating left or right will make is actually circle a bit (maybe 1 meter from where I started the yaw) instead of actually rotating like I would have expected it to, but I decided this is just the way it does rotation using 4 props rather than a tail rotor like I am used to.

I have gone out of range about 5 times during my 30 flights and it has returned home as expected every time. Only once did I let it land by itself (just to see what it did). Every other time I took control once it was nearer me by flipping the S1 switch from top to center and then I put it back in the top position.

I just think with the newest Phantom 2 vision+ everyone should trust the software and besides loosing satellites to the point of entering 'Attitude Mode', the Phantom will behave as expected (even then it would be as expected and told in the manual--entering attitude mode). I personally will not take off further than 100 feet from myself unless I have 9+ satellites. I don't trust having less than this. I usually end up with between 11-13 satellites by the time I strike out far enough away or high enough that I can't maintain orientation on my own from the ground (which isn't that far with a symmetrical, one foot wide quadcopter).

 

[robininni]

It is fun to fly and you can take some great pics/video in Phantom mode. And it is REALLY smart to stay in that mode until you have flying down. However... NAZA is equivalent to giving you a lot more options/tools to use if you choose. And it is a way to allow you more speed and control - if you want it.

I think it comes down to preferences. If Phantom mode suits your needs and works for you - then enjoy. If you need the functionality that NAZA provides and desire more control options, then go for it.

For me, I flew for quite awhile in Phantom (until I felt really comfortable) then I tried NAZA and to be honest I would never go back. IMHO it is more fun to fly.

Don't rush to judgment until you have spent some time in both modes

+1
The above, IMHO, is excellent advice!
It's pretty cool that these wonderful machines have options that address both Beginner and Advanced users.
I'm staying in the Phantom mode - for now. I'm still working on smooth figure 8's and flying smooth circles around fixed objects - in both directions! That may be easy for you Advanced Guys but it's a real challenge for me - but I am getting much better! (Practice, Practice!!) I look forward to trying/switching to NAZA and figuring out what works best for me!

I guess I'm looking at "why switch to Naza Mode" from an intermediate pilot's standpoint who can fly circles, figure eights, nose-in hover, etc. with a heli with nothing more than a typical simple gyro (non heading hold) and I just don't get spending $1300 on a Phantom 2 Vision+ to 'practice' safely in Phantom Mode so that I can graduate to removing safeguards, making flying more difficult, and try to mimic what I could achieve spending 25% of the money on a 'regular' heli or quadcopter without GPS stabilization, altimeter, and compass. Just buy something much less expensive such as a Blade mcx2 to learn orientation as safely as possible--safe to you and your money. Then buy a Blade cp x to 'graduate' to 'real' flying and still be safe with yourself and wallet. Then buy a bigger size 30 (gas) or 450 (electric) heli and have more fun flying 'manual' than a Phantom provides. Or... get a Phantom 2 Vision+ no matter what your experience level and fly unbelievably easy with awesome technology.

 

[IrishSights]

Re: Why not stay in "Phantom" mode?

I just don't get spending $1300 on a Phantom 2 Vision+ to

I guess we have all just totally wasted our time replying to your post as we have tried, at length, to explain why. You seemed to be stuck in the mindset of staying a beginner. That's fine but most of us want to move on.

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