What about TFR's for sports stadiums during Covid-19 lockdown?

[jephoto]

This is a hypothetical since I've really not started flying again yet. I'm in Chicago and though we've had a few nice days, everything still looks crappy so (for me) not much point.
But wondering about the scheduled TFR's because of sports stadiums which normally prevent us from flying within 3 miles of an event with 30,000 or more. We have 2 Baseball,1 Football, Hockey and basketball stadiums here and when I click on a spot that's within a TFR radius for a game that's (obviously) not happening because of the Covid-19 stay at home orders, the map is still RED - as if a game were to be played.

How far in advance does the TFR event maps get scheduled? How often are they updated?
If a game is NOT happening, will we still not be able to even start our motors or run into the " no-fly wall " ?

Just curious. Looks to me like the RED NoFly zones for scheduled games will still be in effect, even if no one is there....

 

[WV. Rootman]

A TFR is a TFR. How's that for a sentence? If it is there you don't fly. It doesn't matter who is in the stadium or not.

 

[skymonkey]

Some stadiums are being used for covid 19 testing and as field hospitals. You might want to drive by and check it out.

 

[mossphotography]

There are currently NO sporting TFRs because there are no games. There are already two wrong answers in this thread.

Rootman is wrong because there TFR is only in affect during games, and 1 hour before and after. It most certainly does matter who is in the stadium as well. It only applies to stadiums with the capacity of 30,000 or more, and only during "1) A REGULAR OR POST SEASON MAJOR LEAGUE BASEBALL, NATIONAL FOOTBALL... LEAGUE, OR NCAA DIVISION ONE FOOTBALL GAME IS OCCURRING; OR 2) A NASCAR CUP, INDY CAR, OR CHAMP SERIES RACE IS OCCURRING, EXCLUDING QUALIFYING AND PRE-RACE EVENTS."

And skymonkey is wrong too for the same reason. A COVID hospital will not be part of the sporting TFR. It may have it's own TFR, but that is incredibly unlikely.

Just because there is a stadium in the area, that does not mean we can't fly there.

And it's actually not a TFR, it is now a NOTAM. Specifically NOTAM 7/4319.

You can read it in its entirety here: 7/4319 NOTAM Details

 

[Fat Albert]

This is a hypothetical since I've really not started flying again yet. I'm in Chicago and though we've had a few nice days, everything still looks crappy so (for me) not much point.
But wondering about the scheduled TFR's because of sports stadiums which normally prevent us from flying within 3 miles of an event with 30,000 or more. We have 2 Baseball,1 Football, Hockey and basketball stadiums here and when I click on a spot that's within a TFR radius for a game that's (obviously) not happening because of the Covid-19 stay at home orders, the map is still RED - as if a game were to be played.

How far in advance does the TFR event maps get scheduled? How often are they updated?
If a game is NOT happening, will we still not be able to even start our motors or run into the " no-fly wall " ?

Just curious. Looks to me like the RED NoFly zones for scheduled games will still be in effect, even if no one is there....

Buy NoLimitDronz and fly anywhere,anytime you wish, no such thing as a NFZ or Altitude limit ever again... Simple to install

 

[jephoto]

A TFR is a TFR. How's that for a sentence? If it is there you don't fly. It doesn't matter who is in the stadium or not.

For the record- I definitely wasn't implying in any way that I want to, or would tell anyone else to, fly in a TFR. At all. Dumb way to get in trouble and loose my 107, and potentially cost me a lot of money
.
I was wondering how the mechanism works and if say there's a TFR today in chicago (there is from 12:10pm -6:10 for a White Sox/Rangers baseball game), and all such events are cancelled. And many large sporting events are now cancelled the next couple of months-at least all over the country, maybe longer- will any of the scheduled TFR's be cancelled?
And if so, would DJI's software reflect it?

 

[jephoto]

Buy NoLimitDronz and fly anywhere,anytime you wish, no such thing as a NFZ or Altitude limit ever again... Simple to install

Bad idea. Bad advice. NFZ's are there whether you work around them or not.

 

[jephoto]

There are currently NO sporting TFRs because there are no games. There are already two wrong answers in this thread.

Rootman is wrong because there TFR is only in affect during games, and 1 hour before and after. It most certainly does matter who is in the stadium as well. It only applies to stadiums with the capacity of 30,000 or more, and only during "1) A REGULAR OR POST SEASON MAJOR LEAGUE BASEBALL, NATIONAL FOOTBALL... LEAGUE, OR NCAA DIVISION ONE FOOTBALL GAME IS OCCURRING; OR 2) A NASCAR CUP, INDY CAR, OR CHAMP SERIES RACE IS OCCURRING, EXCLUDING QUALIFYING AND PRE-RACE EVENTS."

And skymonkey is wrong too for the same reason. A COVID hospital will not be part of the sporting TFR. It may have it's own TFR, but that is incredibly unlikely.

Just because there is a stadium in the area, that does not mean we can't fly there.

And it's actually not a TFR, it is now a NOTAM. Specifically NOTAM 7/4319.

You can read it in its entirety here: 7/4319 NOTAM Details

So you are saying that as far as the FAA goes- there aren't any TFR's currently around major sporting stadiums, over 30,000 people at the moment. That the FAA did in fact adjust the TFRs. Which makes sense if nobody is there.
BUT- right now in Airmap if I click on the area by Adler Planetarium on Chicago's lakefront which is at just about the edge of the normal TFR zone for Cellular Field Stadium some 3 miles away, it definitely gives me a RED No fly TFR .
I just tried to submit the flight plan for right now - ad it says "No airspace authorization is available"

So -maybe the FAA canceled the TFR - but the software we need to use to actually fly hasn't gotten the message.
I'm not driving down there to see if Go will let me fire up. But I'd bet I wouldn't be able to.
Try going to DJI's Flysafe page and input Zipcode 60605, address is 1300 S. Lake Shore Drive, chicago, IL. 60605 and see what you get.
I am getting 3 different TFRs - 1 for today and 1 each for tomorrow and the next day.
All sporting events.

 

[jephoto]

Another thing occurred to me- if I did manage to get the motors going and fly, I might not be able to get insurance from Verifly if the TFRs are showing up on everyone's software, probably on theirs too. So if there was an incident, I probably would not be covered.
This is why I brought this up in the first place - it's a cascade of What If's....

 

[WV. Rootman]

Another thing occurred to me- if I did naming to get the motors going and fly, I might not be able to get insurance from Verifly if the TFRs are showing up on everyone's software, probably on theirs too. So if there was an incident, I probably would not be covered.
This is why I brought this up in the first place - it's a cascade of What If's....

Maybe there are just misunderstandings in our statements all around. I was only saying, if there is a TFR there is no flying. Whether it should be there or not. Whether it's a mistake or not. As you stated, why take that kind of risk.

Mr. Mossphotography, I said nothing wrong in my statement. I never said anything about the time of a TFR. If there is a TFR you don't fly, no matter what the circumstances are. You're reading too much from a simple statement.
I don't care how many people is in the stadium for a TFR or a NOTAM! If it's there, I'm not flying. PERIOD! I like to keep it simple.

 

[jephoto]

What Rootman said about there actually being NO sporting TFRs at the moment is apparently true. I checked for Chicago region here: Federal Aviation Administration - Graphic TFR's
And it’s true. Unfortunately DJI, Airmap, and I’m sure the other softwares we use to check or get authorizations haven’t gotten the message.
So as far as the FAA is concerned it’s legal to fly these areas/ but we may not be able to anyway.
If Go shows Red, we can’t fire up the motors.

 

[Fat Albert]

Bad idea. Bad advice. NFZ's are there whether you work around them or not.

I don’t see what the big deal is flying over Ann empty stadium

 

[jephoto]

I don’t see what the big deal is flying over Ann empty stadium

Missing the point FA.
I don’t care about the STADIUMS, I care about the 3 Nautical miles around the stadiums that I can’t fly.
In the spring, summer and fall there are many days when we have at least 3 different stadium games on a single day cutting out a very large area of the city as a NFZ.

 

[jephoto]

Update:
I had written to Airamap customer support to ask about this and got a reply today:

************************************

Marshall (AirMap) Apr 20, 09:55 PDT Hello Jeff, Thank you very much for reaching out to AirMap detailing this experience! I do apologize for the issue of Sport TFRs displaying in the AIrMap app. The TFR data for sporting events is currently affecting the whole dataset. I apologize if you continue to experience the same data type appearing nationwide, we are diligently working to carefully remove this data from the app as soon as possible. Please feel free to stay in close contact with us for more up to date information regarding these changes! Best Regards, Marshall Customer Success, AirMap [email protected] +844.4AIRMAP ext 1 ************************************

I replied that there wasn't a need for an apology. Just wanted to understand what was up. It's all a nightmare for everyone

But at least I know that there are not any TFRs- just ghosts of them in various software.
And I can't even go to the lakefront here (Chicago) due to the Social distancing lockdown anyway.
Every park & beach is basically closed to the public right now.

 

[pdqdl]

There are currently NO sporting TFRs because there are no games. There are already two wrong answers in this thread.

Rootman is wrong because there TFR is only in affect during games, and 1 hour before and after. It most certainly does matter who is in the stadium as well. It only applies to stadiums with the capacity of 30,000 or more, and only during "1) A REGULAR OR POST SEASON MAJOR LEAGUE BASEBALL, NATIONAL FOOTBALL... LEAGUE, OR NCAA DIVISION ONE FOOTBALL GAME IS OCCURRING; OR 2) A NASCAR CUP, INDY CAR, OR CHAMP SERIES RACE IS OCCURRING, EXCLUDING QUALIFYING AND PRE-RACE EVENTS."

And skymonkey is wrong too for the same reason. A COVID hospital will not be part of the sporting TFR. It may have it's own TFR, but that is incredibly unlikely.

Just because there is a stadium in the area, that does not mean we can't fly there.

And it's actually not a TFR, it is now a NOTAM. Specifically NOTAM 7/4319.

You can read it in its entirety here: 7/4319 NOTAM Details

Excellent post! I checked your link, and thought to myself, "This is buried too deep for anyone to find."

That being said, I also didn't even know what a NOTAM was, so I did some checking. An entertaining comment from Wikipedia:

"In July 2017, Air Canada Flight 759 nearly crashed into four other airliners as it attempted to land on a San Francisco taxiway misidentified as a runway: the next runway was closed but the information was buried in the NOTAM. In September 2018, the NTSB stated NOTAMs were unintelligible and ignored, and recommended a more effective information presentation for better relevance. "​

Thus, in my very first glance at an actual NOTAM, I came to the same conclusion as the NTSB. That makes me wonder why they are still unintelligible.

Slightly related factoid: the Kansas City, Mo police helipad is only 3900 feet (1.18 Km) away from the Arrowhead stadium, home of the current world champion football team. That's American football, not Soccer (as we call what the rest of the world knows as "football"). Don't you just know they have an exemption from that NOTAM under the "law enforcement" clause.

 

[mossphotography]

So you are saying that as far as the FAA goes- there aren't any TFR's currently around major sporting stadiums, over 30,000 people at the moment. That the FAA did in fact adjust the TFRs. Which makes sense if nobody is there.
BUT- right now in Airmap if I click on the area by Adler Planetarium on Chicago's lakefront which is at just about the edge of the normal TFR zone for Cellular Field Stadium some 3 miles away, it definitely gives me a RED No fly TFR .
I just tried to submit the flight plan for right now - ad it says "No airspace authorization is available"

So -maybe the FAA canceled the TFR - but the software we need to use to actually fly hasn't gotten the message.
I'm not driving down there to see if Go will let me fire up. But I'd bet I wouldn't be able to.
Try going to DJI's Flysafe page and input Zipcode 60605, address is 1300 S. Lake Shore Drive, chicago, IL. 60605 and see what you get.
I am getting 3 different TFRs - 1 for today and 1 each for tomorrow and the next day.
All sporting events.

That's because Airmap sucks when it comes to ghost TFRs (among a myriad of other reasons they suck).

 

[MPPilot]

Really? We're talking about how to do things legally and you think it's appropriate to insert a commercial promoting products to fly illegally?

Buy NoLimitDronz and fly anywhere,anytime you wish, no such thing as a NFZ or Altitude limit ever again... Simple to install

 

[RocketBrew]

I flew a roof inspection when there was a ghost Stadium TFR. Submitted a Custom Unlock to DJI, they unlocked within minutes.

 

[jephoto]

I flew a roof inspection when there was a ghost Stadium TFR. Submitted a Custom Unlock to DJI, they unlocked within minutes.

That’s good to know.
We’re You were able to do that onsite, or did you do it from Home First? I think you can’t do it on site for a custom unlock- but I’m rusty from months of not flying on this stuff.

 

[RocketBrew]

I submitted it while on-site, from my notebook PC.

That’s good to know.
We’re You were able to do that onsite, or did you do it from Home First? I think you can’t do it on site for a custom unlock- but I’m rusty from months of not flying on this stuff.