Phantom 4 flipped over, flew powered into ground from 200 feet!

[wa5tef]

On January 21, my Phantom 4 was at 419 feet. I started a descent normally it seemed until at about 200 feet it flipped over and proceeded straight to the ground very fast. I reacted giving full throttle up to halt the fall but not knowing the drone was inverted, it flew faster. It hit the ground hard and bounced. Upon arriving at the crash site, I found the drone laying on its top, propellers all broken but all lights on, the battery showing 3 green LED's with one blinking, ready for the next flight command! I video'd the site for record then took the drone inside, cleaned the mud off the top and attached new propellers. Powered it up and all seemed to work except the gimbal. The drone had hit the ground so hard that the gimbal mount or camera had dented the housing just above it. The camera worked fine, only the gimbal was a little stiff. I carried it outside, grabbed my iPhone to video the event and powered it up at idle. It seemed normal so I flew it up to about 3 feet and tried the yaw commands, all normal, then to about 10 feet and tried the forward, left and right and back stick commands and again normal. SO, to have a Phantom do a power dive from 200 feet and basically survive is awesome! The toughness of this craft is amazing. The top shell was slightly damaged on two of the arms but since the drone hit flat on its propellers, it apparently was not damaged too bad.
SO, I know everyone is wondering why the drone flipped? I am too? I sent the drone to DJI for repair with a request to review the flight logs to determine what happened. No response. I called support, promised an email explaining same, no results. Emailed support, got same promise, same response. Got on DJI Forum and posted for about a week and no one has had a good idea why the drone flipped and DJI rep promised to get the flight logs and advise, but still waiting. Also, no one has been able to tell me how it is possible to make a Phantom fly upside down! I paid for the repairs and had the drone repaired and it is on its way back here, set to arrive Thursday but without knowing why it flipped, I am afraid to fly it again.

Can anyone, help. I need to know how it is possible to flip? No, no prop, no motor, no anything failure noted. No bird strike, no tree strike, no wind gust, etc. No external conditions that could have caused it.

Anyone please! Thanks,
Jim
WA5TEF

 

[wa5tef]

Also, I might add. I tried to review the flight logs on my iPad and they mysteriously stopped recording on November 27th and picked up again January 19th. The crash was January 21st. There are recordings of my tests and test flights after the crash but no record of the actual event. Can anyone suggest where these might be saved and/or why they were not recorded? I still had over 20 GB available on the SD card.
Thanks,
Jim
WA5TEF

 

[F3honda4me]

I could have helped you get the answer but since you sent it to DJI the DAT file will be gone when you get it back.

 

[wa5tef]

Heck! I wish I had known DJI was going to be so hard to deal with and I'd have held off in sending it to them. I wonder though, since the flight records were not recorded on my iPad which I used it to fly that day, do you think the DAT file was intact on the drone?
Thanks,
Jim
WA5TEF

 

[Hammer]

any drone going full throttle or even no throttle should not be in any shape to fly again not to mention still powered up when you found it. Its seems to me there is more to this story than im seeing.

we had an inspire suddenly loose power while hovering at 10-15 feet and it was completely destroyed when it hit the ground

 

[F3honda4me]

Heck! I wish I had known DJI was going to be so hard to deal with and I'd have held off in sending it to them. I wonder though, since the flight records were not recorded on my iPad which I used it to fly that day, do you think the DAT file was intact on the drone?
Thanks,
Jim
WA5TEF

Yes the drone is always logging.

 

[wa5tef]

OK, here is the full story. I planned on a short flight to get a photo of my house. I flew straight up to 419 feet, turned off the video recording in order to make a still shot, then started a descent. I did not turn on the video again since I intended to land. While descending at about 200 to 250 feet, the Phantom suddenly flipped over perfectly upside down and accelerated towards the ground. I noticed the rapid fall and quickly applied full power to stop the fall, not realizing the drone was upside down. Of course, this only added more speed to the fall. The drone smacked the ground flat on its top and propellers and bounced. When I got to it, I expected to find a pile of rubble but there it lay, all lights on, strobes blinking and the battery still intact showing 3 green LED's and one blinking. All four props were broken and the top shell had damage on two of the motor arms. I photographed the site and videoed it for reference then took the drone inside, cleaned it up, replaced the propellers and inserted a different battery. It powered up immediately, giving me a gimble motor bind or something like that. The Phantom's camera worked fine and I made a photo inside the house with it. I then decided to try it out, took it back outside and turned on the iPhone video camera to record the startup. The drone fired up normally, sitting there idling. I applied a little power to raise it to about three feet and tested the left stick controls, worked fine. I flew it to about ten feet and tested the right stick controls and again all worked fine. I believe I then landed and inspected everything noticing the gimbal mount was binding. I flew it a couple more times for short flights only. I then went back inside and calibrated the gimbal mount and got it to working part of the time but it was still binding when going from level to vertical down. I contacted DJI and got authorization to send it for repair. It reached DJI Monday of this week and was repaired and returned yesterday!!!!! Total cost was $239.00. I was impressed at the speed of repair however I requested many times and through many different channels for someone to explain how this crash happened. My flight data logs on my iPad mysteriously stopped recording on November 27th and started back January 19th but the crash was January 21 and the flight was not recorded. I have gotten on DJI's forum and asked for information about this situation and what happened to the flight logs and no one has any answers. I am still waiting on DJI to "get back to me" with their side of what happened but I know for sure that it was not pilot error for I was doing nothing but descending. The drone did not hit anything unless it was a bird and the weather was fine. It was 69.9 degrees, winds out of the SSE at 3 MPH. I did not record the barometric pressure but I do have that data on my weather station if needed but there were no weather systems approaching so I assume the pressure was fairly stable.

I expect my Phantom to be here Thursday and I will indeed carefully check it out at low altitude before I am reasonable comfortable with it again. I do hope DJI will give me their version of the crash but I have already guessed it will be pilot error, since I paid the bill without question. My question to the group is: What caused a perfectly healthy Phantom 4 to suddenly do a perfect flip to the upside down position unless something internal malfunctioned? Can anyone make their drone flip over to that position??? Nope I think not, not that anyone would try but any drone flyer knows that they are inherently stable and should recover from most any flip over at altitude if nothing went wrong. On one occasion, I foolishly hoovered my drone about five feet to test its "lifting power" by tugging on one of the landing struts. It resisted the pull and fought to keep its condition upright. I did feel the strength of the motors and the power of the drone to right itself if tilted. So, what else could have caused this crash?

I appreciate anyone's questions as I struggle to find out the cause before I attempt to fly it again.
Thanks a bunch!
Jim
WA5TEF

 

[AlecW]

I don't believe you will ever find out what happened, you paid for the repair so there is zero chance DJI will tell you what happened. I doubt the drone coming back is the same one you sent in.

 

[F3honda4me]

Again without the log from the drone there is nothing anyone can tell you that is anything more than a pure guess.

 

[GadgetGuy]

This is water under the bridge now, but before paying for the repair, you should have demanded that it be covered under warranty, with the burden on them to prove pilot error in the .DAT file of the flight, recorded on an internal 4GB microSD card, used as the internal aircraft black box, which records all the crash data. Once you paid, DJI destroyed all evidence of the cause of the crash (which was undoubtedly a warranty covered issue), and I'm sure you will be sent a refurbished P4 from someone else's crashed P4 aircraft, and not your original aircraft. Check the serial number when you get it. I bought a certified DJI Refurbished P4 from a DJI distributor, which was promised to be only an "open box" 7 day DJI return, and discovered that it was, in fact, a crashed aircraft, and that DJI's "Refurbished" repairs are very shoddy, with stripped screw heads on the camera mounts, and missing camera ribbon cable clips and missing Wifi antenna clips that add additional reinforcement to those component connections, which were removed, but not reinstalled! Returned aircraft arrive loose, in a box of styrofoam peanuts! Cheesy! If you have any question about the Refurb you receive, demand another.

 

[AlecW]

This is water under the bridge now, but before paying for the repair, you should have demanded that it be covered under warranty, with the burden on them to prove pilot error in the .DAT file of the flight, recorded on an internal 4GB microSD card, used as the internal aircraft black box, which records all the crash data.

This is the part I don't get. If I crashed and even if there was a slight possibility that it was my fault I'd at least try to get dji to cover it before I got my credit card out

 

[wa5tef]

Yep, I see your point in paying for it immediately. I guess I mostly trusted DJI to be honest but it appear from all the negative posts I see on the forums that they may not be. I think maybe that since my records were not recorded, the on board records were not either. I appreciate your all responding to my plight and I have left a challenge for DJI to duplicate the crash with pilot error being the cause. You all and I know that it can't be done, not UNLESS

 

[wa5tef]

**MORE** hit the wrong key--- Not UNLESS something internal went wrong, and which mandated a warranty payment for the damages. I assure you that if DJI tries to pass off another drone on me, unless it is NEW, I will probably consult with an attorney for pursuit of this and more. I've about had it with DJI! Their service department is awesome but their support people are afraid to *&#%^ without permission from China. I hate that such a tough machine is built there but maybe we can find a better company soon that has a service representative establishment that is interested in seeing what is done right, not what is best for the bottom line. I am sure my $239.00 will really chock up a hit on their stock for a few days??? Thanks again for posting. IF I get a response from DJI, WHICH I DOUBT I WILL, I will post it here for all to witness.

Jim
WA5TEF

 

[GadgetGuy]

Yep, I see your point in paying for it immediately. I guess I mostly trusted DJI to be honest but it appear from all the negative posts I see on the forums that they may not be. I think maybe that since my records were not recorded, the on board records were not either. I appreciate your all responding to my plight and I have left a challenge for DJI to duplicate the crash with pilot error being the cause. You all and I know that it can't be done, not UNLESS

If you send it in for repair, they will bill you without determining cause, and if you pay it, without questioning it, they will send you back a refurb. If you send it in for warranty, they must first determine the cause of the crash. If the .DAT file didn't get recorded, that, in and of itself, is a manufacturing defect, requiring replacement under warranty. Look at it this way. The $239 repair cost was cheaper than if you had paid for DJI Care!

 

[AlecW]

I assure you that if DJI tries to pass off another drone on me, unless it is NEW, I will probably consult with an attorney for pursuit of this and more.

I can assure you there is next to no chance that the bird in the mail is the one you sent in and that your attorney will read DJI's repair/replacement policy that you agreed to and walk away.

 

[wa5tef]

Well, I have questioned it from January 23rd. Every day! Sometimes multiple times a day. And still DJI (Commie China) does not advise what caused the crash. If they do send me back another drone, I'll probably sue them in local Justice Court, which has jurisdiction over state lines IF they sell interstate to the great state of Mississippi! I realize that $239.00 is not enough to fight over but not knowing what caused the drone to flip has to be answered! I'll keep this post alive until I find out. Thanks to all that are following. Keep an eye on DJI if what I am reading is correct.
Thanks
Jim
WA5TEF

 

[DanMan32]

If a phantom flips, I don't think it will easily right itself. I tipped a telephone wire at about 15 feet and it did not recover. Hit the ground, broke gimbal in 3 pieces, seam between upper and lower she'll separated, landing legs bent. I could not quickly shut off the motors via CSC where they continued to spin upside down grinding the hub tips flat.
Paid for gimbal repair but seemed to get a new or refurb one as the original camera body was gouged but the one I have is pristine. They missed the bearings on one of the motors starting to go, ended up replacing it myself instead of waiting another three weeks turnaround. I sent the broken props, they never sent new ones I asked for and they said they would include but sent the broken ones instead.

Sent from my HTC 10 using PhantomPilots mobile app

 

[wa5tef]

Yep, I assume that will be true. BUT, Mississippi has some good local laws that cover situations like this and I believe I can printout all my postings and my replies from DJI, not to include ov course the phone calls that cannot be recorded without permission, and put together a pretty good case. I'll let everyone keep up on this matter. In the meantime, if anyone knows how a drone can be made to "fflip", please post it here.
Thanks,
Jim
WA5TEF

 

[AlecW]

Well, I have questioned it from January 23rd. Every day! Sometimes multiple times a day.

On the other forum DJI Ken said you PM'ed him several times within 15 mins and you were mad it took him an hour or so to reply. Just saying....

 

[wa5tef]

WOW! I hate to deal with dishonest people, corporations, or liars! I hope your postings that I have read here, and on four other forums are incorrect. I will not take a substituted drone if they try to switch it on me. That will really stir up some "stuff". Thanks for the warnings!
Jim
WA5TEF