4K 60FPS?

Joined
Dec 10, 2016
Messages
22
Reaction score
14
Age
45
So i have had a Phantom 4, Inspire 1 Pro X5 etc.. but i always loved the Phantom, so i got the Pro and set all the video settings to the highest possible, i filmed the clip below today and im very confused as to why the video looks jagged in the beginning and gets better through near the middle/end?

Is it possible that 4K 60FPS is a bad setting, maybe i should be using 30FPS? My Go app is version 4.0, everything is on latest firmware and the settings are set to auto.

Take a look and tell me what you think this may be from? Thanks

 
Joined
May 23, 2016
Messages
946
Reaction score
214
Age
56
Hi Tommy,

There is a global bottleneck of 100mbps so it seems the encoder has to strech information at 4k 60. Can you try same shot with lower fps and compare?

Find discussion here;

4k60p is.. not true 4k.


Sent from my iPhone using PhantomPilots
 
Joined
Nov 17, 2016
Messages
1,071
Reaction score
477
Age
62
Location
Utah, USA
Yeah, 4K 60fps sounds nice but I'd rather devote the 100Mbps to 4K 30fps than have to compress the video more to handle the higher bandwidth of 4K 60fps. If I wanted 60fps I'd downgrade to a lower resolution.


Brian
 
Joined
Oct 6, 2016
Messages
151
Reaction score
50
Age
45
So would 4k 30 be a good choice for high quality and sharpness? I feel like the 4k 60 had a general softness unless I was shooting up close, then it was pretty nice. Here's a short clip of 4k 60 up close.
 

Zzz

Joined
Nov 22, 2016
Messages
141
Reaction score
27
Age
35
4k 60 is aparently skiping lines, hence the softness and aliasing... it's BS to be honest, not worth using in its current form of implementation.
 
  • Like
Reactions: TommyBayshore
Joined
Dec 10, 2016
Messages
22
Reaction score
14
Age
45
Thanks for the info everyone, so is it safe to assume i dont have a defective P4 Pro? Someone had said change it to H.265 and 30FPS for best quality, does that sound like the way to go?
 
Joined
Dec 10, 2016
Messages
22
Reaction score
14
Age
45
So would 4k 30 be a good choice for high quality and sharpness? I feel like the 4k 60 had a general softness unless I was shooting up close, then it was pretty nice. Here's a short clip of 4k 60 up close.
The 4K 60 has a "softness" for sure, i noticed that, i couldn't tell if i liked it or didnt like it..
 
Joined
Dec 10, 2016
Messages
22
Reaction score
14
Age
45
4k 60 is aparently skiping lines, hence the softness and aliasing... it's BS to be honest, not worth using in its current form of implementation.
Would H.265 30FPS be good to use?
 
Joined
May 23, 2016
Messages
946
Reaction score
214
Age
56
Use for what, what kind of takes please, and will you editing software handle as needed?

Many are ie happy i.e.!with 3072.


Sent from my iPhone using PhantomPilots
 
Last edited:
Joined
Dec 10, 2016
Messages
22
Reaction score
14
Age
45
For buildings, real estate, some personal stuff on the beach etc... my editing software is iMovie on my iMac, i dont change any settings in post, i usually just trim the video and add music etc... i just set it to 4K 24FPS in H.265, gonna test it real quick.
 
Joined
Dec 2, 2016
Messages
85
Reaction score
77
Age
36
The issue with H.265 is that it's not currently supported natively in iMovie or Final Cut Pro X on a mac. So if that's what you're using and don't want to go through the hassle of converting your footage to prores first, you'll be better off using h.264. 30fps is a good frame rate if your final output medium is going to be the web.

The image quality difference between h.265 and h.264 isn't noticeable on casual inspection, you'd really need to be pixel peeping. Something I suspect your clients aren't going to be doing.
 
  • Like
Reactions: RémyHeli
Joined
May 23, 2016
Messages
946
Reaction score
214
Age
56
Excellent point re 265 vs 264, and in your case you might want adopt approach where whole process is consistent from take to publish without hassle and extra conversion. Aka H264 and bit lower res/fps, but really up to you.

Hope does help!


Sent from my iPhone using PhantomPilots
 
Last edited:
Joined
Dec 12, 2016
Messages
14
Reaction score
3
Age
44
Maybe it´s still of some interest for you - I did some tests with ISO charts and the result is as assumed. 4K/50&60p uses lineskipping/pixelbinning as FHD/120p does, so the vertical resolution is about half the expected in UHD/60p. I think it´s a little better than half the resolution since we have a oversamplingsensor here giving even good results in blue an red resolution as in blue/red situations that surpass native resolving bayer sensors.



Please consider that the UHD test charts were filmed in only half the size, so the FHD files have the standard 5,62% of the picture height, UHD has 2,81% of the picture hight per single chart (to be honest the charts were filmed nearly 2% to small). Charts represent 100% pixelsize coming out of the cameras. Tests were done in the center of the image, so corner performance will degrade due to lens performance and lens distortion correction.


I also did a test against the old Phantom 3 Pro and my Sony Alpha 6500. Charts are a bit different since I wanted to check resolution in lower contrast scenes. Result is that at least without motion there is no difference.


Since I live in a PAL country all these tests were done using PAL frequencies. I also checked NTSC frequencies and these look the very same as the PAL ones. So 30p looks like 25p, 60p and 48p looks like 50p.

For me this new drone performs very well, even against a 2.4 times oversampling Sony a6500. The old P3 Pro is easily surpassed.
What annoys me more is that detail quality ceases if the copter/image is in motion in real scenes. Picture seems to become somewhat "unsharp". Maybe this is caused by some ghosting the camera produces in motion, but I´m not sure yet.
 
Joined
Jul 18, 2013
Messages
335
Reaction score
106
With the exception of 2 extra guidance eyes in the rear and better stills, the P4P doesn't offer much more over the P4. 4k60fps is a waste of time and the H.365 codec is flawed and needs to be tweaked. The correct implementation is in the Inspire 2 where theres a 300+ transfer rate to a SSD drive.
 
Joined
Dec 12, 2016
Messages
14
Reaction score
3
Age
44
The P4 Pro does offer an advantage over the P3 Pro and P4. Videos look much "deeper" with more 3D effect, the codec is greatly improved since the I-Frame flicker of the P3/P4 goes to nearly invisible, at least it is greatly reduced when not graded! Noise is reduced and resolution, at least when not in motion is also increased by a margin as you can see from the charts above.
You can´t expect RAW from a "toy priced" multicopter in comparison to a completely rigged Inspire 2. Not to forget a Phantom is much more transportable.
4K 60fps is also not a waste since you would have some motion blur when flying straightforward for example in many cases. So the reduced resolution wouldn´t really matter here.

On the other hand I like fast shutter times and let my 4K TV do frame interpolation. That´s something where the P4 Pro seems to suffer since even with short shutter times resolution and sharpness degrades.

The rule shutter time set to half the frame rate isn´t always valid for me since in motion everything get´s blurred and you lose the complete resolution advantage of 4K, but that´s just my 2c...
 
  • Like
Reactions: RémyHeli
Joined
Aug 16, 2016
Messages
86
Reaction score
16
Age
52
Cameras shooting in MPEG will always have a sharper image when standing still as the compression can work at maximum efficiency and cram lots of image data into the 100mb/sec. If you are shooting at 30fps the 100mb is used to store all the images in that group of frames (apparently 30 frames on the P4P shooting at 30fps). If the camera is not moving then most of the 100mb is devoted to the I-frame creating a nicely detailed image. If the camera is moving (even rather slowly) then the I-frame gets many fewer bits allocated as more bits are needed to encode the following frames in the group with large changes.

That is why I dream of an Inspire 3 (will be awhile before I can afford it).
 
  • Like
Reactions: RémyHeli
Joined
Dec 12, 2016
Messages
14
Reaction score
3
Age
44
Marcel, you are right, I was also wondering about this.
This effect was never that visible with my former P3 Pro or my a6500.
In contrast the P4P has significant more effective resolution than the P3P (due to the sensor oversampling), so even more information to store. This may be the reason for the lower sharpness.
On the other hand my a6500 has even more resolution, but I don't see the effect there...

Thanks RémiHeli!!


Sent from my iPhone using PhantomPilots
 
Joined
May 23, 2016
Messages
946
Reaction score
214
Age
56
There was a petition one year ago for the P3 Pro, for an option to allow increasing bitrate for choosen res (against lowered bitrate) as possibly supported by Ambarella A9 processor, but then sdcard limitation (user can put wathever sdcard causing issues) or higher consumption and temperature. But category product plays a role.


Sent from my iPhone using PhantomPilots
 
Last edited:

New Threads

Forum statistics

Threads
135,824
Messages
1,405,160
Members
98,879
Latest member
KillerG63